Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Discussions relating to the classical guitar which don't fit elsewhere.
Jeffrey Armbruster
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Jeffrey Armbruster » Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:14 am

Yep, that's why I'm comfortable driving an 'automatic' CRV.
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montana
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by montana » Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:45 am

Muggins Simoon wrote:I like 'guitar'
And beer

montana
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by montana » Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:47 am

Peter Lovett wrote:
kapustinnik wrote:... Well my pianist colleague in the faculty once joked "Classical guitar is bunch of egocentric banjo players trying to dress up like concert pianists"
Ouch...... :shock:
Why would anyone take a shoot at banjo players?

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Mark Featherstone
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Mark Featherstone » Fri Apr 08, 2016 10:09 am

montana wrote:
Peter Lovett wrote:
kapustinnik wrote:... Well my pianist colleague in the faculty once joked "Classical guitar is bunch of egocentric banjo players trying to dress up like concert pianists"
Ouch...... :shock:
Why would anyone take a shoot at banjo players?
Accordion players, sure. But banjo?
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Stephen Faulk
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Stephen Faulk » Mon Apr 11, 2016 8:21 am

This thread is really funny.

A little tremolo goes a long way, but I don't hate it. Sometimes it seems like cheap parlor trick and other times it can be emotionally done.

Clown suits, no. It would be awesome however if someone played a concert at Carnegie or Wigmore Hall including the Ginastera Sonata while wearing a rubber mask of Margret Thatcher or Richard Nixon. Now that would be wonderful and rare.
Patience at the bending iron pays in rounded dividends!

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Frousse
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Frousse » Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:23 pm

fretfulbutplucky wrote:1. Tremolo. What a gimmick. Won't play it, won't listen to it.
2. Classical guitarists wearing tuxedos when they perform. Might as well add the big red nose and giant floppy shoes while you're at it.
3. The name "classical guitar". Need something better, but what? "Fingerstyle" is taken by the steel wire brigade, "nylon string guitar" is clumsy, "acoustic" is too general.
It would be interesting to hear while you don't like the tremolo. Is it because it demands tremendous practice before mastery? Do you like pieces that make use of the tremolo?

I think the attire depends on the venue. Some venues simply require it. There would be something incongruous if the listeners were wearing jacket and tie and the performer was dressed in a tee-shirt.

I also wish we could simply say "guitar". From my own experience, simply saying: "I play the guitar" will in most cases bring a series of questions about the style that you play. Is it jazz? Is it rock? Do you also sing? etc. Saying "classical guitar" eliminates those questions most of the time.

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Brian McCombs
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Brian McCombs » Mon Apr 11, 2016 5:38 pm

I've never liked the terms Spanish guitar/Classical. If, while in conversation, I happen to mention that I make guitars, I often have to stop and clarify that I don't make electric guitars nor steel strung guitars. I always end up saying I make classical guitars or what folks might refer to as the Spanish guitar. And then I normally need to clarify what it is by saying....Y'know it's the guitar without a pick guard thing, the strings are usually nylon..... (then I pause for the cricket sound of silence) I'm no longer surprised by the fact that most folks still have no idea what I mean. Either they instantly know or they don't get it despite lengthy explanation and it is mostly the latter....I live in a farming community. Not saying farmers aren't savvy (my family farms) but the form of music associated with the classical guitar isn't something you'll find on the radio dial around here. Unless you catch the odd tune on NPR....and I'm probably the only one in town tuned into that. I do occasionally get the "you mean a flamenco guitar?.... like the one Charo played. Anyone remember Charo? my goodness...some folks still do I guess. And I have to say....yeah, like that, yeesh. Some people also like to refer to them as Folk guitars as well.

I always try to do my part to educate folks in stating it was the precursor form to the electric and steel strung guitars folks commonly blah blah blah.... In the end, I've stopped bringing up the subject mostly.
Anyways:
I like Guitars of the Classic persuasion. Sounds cooler.

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Stephen Faulk
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Stephen Faulk » Tue Apr 12, 2016 1:21 am

Brian McCombs wrote:I've never liked the terms Spanish guitar/Classical. If, while in conversation, I happen to mention that I make guitars, I often have to stop and clarify that I don't make electric guitars nor steel strung guitars. I always end up saying I make classical guitars or what folks might refer to as the Spanish guitar. And then I normally need to clarify what it is by saying....Y'know it's the guitar without a pick guard thing, the strings are usually nylon..... (then I pause for the cricket sound of silence) I'm no longer surprised by the fact that most folks still have no idea what I mean. Either they instantly know or they don't get it despite lengthy explanation and it is mostly the latter....I live in a farming community. Not saying farmers aren't savvy (my family farms) but the form of music associated with the classical guitar isn't something you'll find on the radio dial around here. Unless you catch the odd tune on NPR....and I'm probably the only one in town tuned into that. I do occasionally get the "you mean a flamenco guitar?.... like the one Charo played. Anyone remember Charo? my goodness...some folks still do I guess. And I have to say....yeah, like that, yeesh. Some people also like to refer to them as Folk guitars as well.

I always try to do my part to educate folks in stating it was the precursor form to the electric and steel strung guitars folks commonly blah blah blah.... In the end, I've stopped bringing up the subject mostly.
Anyways:
I like Guitars of the Classic persuasion. Sounds cooler.
If someone said to me "You mean like the guitar Charo plays?" I would say Exactly like Charo plays. She used play pretty well actually. She never played anything super difficult,but her sound is ok.

If you want to really confuse farmers, say - No No not like Charo, like Chet Atkins, he played a nylon string guitar. Or Willie Nelson, but I charge more to put the holes in the guitar.
Patience at the bending iron pays in rounded dividends!

Ivo Alviz

Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Ivo Alviz » Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:16 am

I don't get it where you coming from.

StevSmar
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by StevSmar » Tue Apr 12, 2016 6:01 am

I hate it that it doesn't matter how beautiful my guitar is, I keep on finding pictures of even more beautiful guitars.

(Yes that was a joke, of course I love looking at pictures of other guitars. I'm happy my guitar doesn't get upset with me doing it...)
Regards,

Steven from Winnipeg

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Stephen Faulk
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Stephen Faulk » Wed Apr 13, 2016 3:11 am

StevSmar wrote:I hate it that it doesn't matter how beautiful my guitar is, I keep on finding pictures of even more beautiful guitars.

(Yes that was a joke, of course I love looking at pictures of other guitars. I'm happy my guitar doesn't get upset with me doing it...)
You just look at guitar magazines for the articles. Sure you do , sure you do. :)
Patience at the bending iron pays in rounded dividends!

thesixthfret
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by thesixthfret » Sun Apr 17, 2016 6:54 pm

FInally, I can come out of the anti-tremolo closet! I thought I was one of the only ones who sighs every time a guitarist pulls out a tremolo piece. Of course when I was starting out Recuerdos was incredible, but most composers after Tarrega (and maybe barrios) who have attempted always seem to fall FAR short (Torroba, Tansman etc). My problem with it is it all just sounds so similar and always is confined to the first 2 or 3 strings.

I think Koshkin's piece Merlin's Dream is a refreshing use of tremolo in that it crosses over to the bass strings and presents tremolo with more modern harmonies and in limited sections, thus it is at least obviously not a Tarrega clone. The same goes for Sakura Variations as recorded by John Williams. Tremolo is best served in small doses IMHO.

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AndreiKrylov
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by AndreiKrylov » Sun Apr 17, 2016 10:58 pm

thesixthfret wrote:FInally, I can come out of the anti-tremolo closet! I thought I was one of the only ones who sighs every time a guitarist pulls out a tremolo piece. Of course when I was starting out Recuerdos was incredible, but most composers after Tarrega (and maybe barrios) who have attempted always seem to fall FAR short (Torroba, Tansman etc). My problem with it is it all just sounds so similar and always is confined to the first 2 or 3 strings.

I think Koshkin's piece Merlin's Dream is a refreshing use of tremolo in that it crosses over to the bass strings and presents tremolo with more modern harmonies and in limited sections, thus it is at least obviously not a Tarrega clone. The same goes for Sakura Variations as recorded by John Williams. Tremolo is best served in small doses IMHO.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! But there are many different types of tremolo and just by definition they sound a bit different (because of different fingering of right hand) and many many other pieces which have not much in common with great work of Tarrega...
I totally agree that you have right to choose whatever you like to listen, but tremolos are not all the same and many lsteners and musicians enjoy pieces with this technique :)
I'd better speak by music...Please listen Andrei Krylov at Spotify, iTunes, Apple Music, Amazon Prime etc. Thanks!

Marshall Dixon
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by Marshall Dixon » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:12 pm

AndreiKrylov wrote:
thesixthfret wrote:FInally, I can come out of the anti-tremolo closet! I thought I was one of the only ones who sighs every time a guitarist pulls out a tremolo piece. Of course when I was starting out Recuerdos was incredible, but most composers after Tarrega (and maybe barrios) who have attempted always seem to fall FAR short (Torroba, Tansman etc). My problem with it is it all just sounds so similar and always is confined to the first 2 or 3 strings.

I think Koshkin's piece Merlin's Dream is a refreshing use of tremolo in that it crosses over to the bass strings and presents tremolo with more modern harmonies and in limited sections, thus it is at least obviously not a Tarrega clone. The same goes for Sakura Variations as recorded by John Williams. Tremolo is best served in small doses IMHO.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! But there are many different types of tremolo and just by definition they sound a bit different (because of different fingering of right hand) and many many other pieces which have not much in common with great work of Tarrega...
I totally agree that you have right to choose whatever you like to listen, but tremolos are not all the same and many lsteners and musicians enjoy pieces with this technique :)
I have a recording; "Andres Segovia and His Contemoraries, Vol. 2" with Guillermo Gomez featured as the other guitarist on this volume. Gomez plays an incredible piece of his own composition called "Tremolo" and he uses more than the first two strings. You can hear this on U tube. To simplify the search include: Andres Segovia Guillermo Gomez tremolo. This was recorded in the 1930's, I believe. That means it was done in one take. What we paid more for in the 1980's when it was called "direct to disc."

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PaulHardy
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Re: Things I Hate About Classical Guitar

Post by PaulHardy » Tue Apr 19, 2016 2:21 pm

I think the tuxedo complaint is a red herring. I haven't seen a performer--guitar or otherwise-- wear standard evening dress for a number of years (occasionally tuxedo jacket with no tie). This includes string quartets, pianists, the Berlin Philharmonic etc.
OK if you watch the New Year's concert from Vienna everyone including the audience is in evening dress but that's a longstanding cultural accretion. Concert-goers don't do that in general.

I really don't like (shan't be saying 'hate', OK?) the kind of recital progamme that goes;

Bach suite, or PFA 998
Sor op 9
Albeniz Asturias/Granada or
Granados Spanish Dance no 4/5
Barrios Ultima/Limosna/Vals op 8 no 4
RdlA

...or slight variants of same. Collectively so boring and unimaginative, even if some of the pieces themselves are fine. A frightening number of recitals used to be built on this spine with only miniscule changes, but thankfully it seems to going away now

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