Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

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tmblweed1
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by tmblweed1 » Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:27 pm

I see several answers here, but I have purchased 2 Bernabes from Savino music in Florida, both in stock. He now shows the new m15 at $3200.00
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

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Erik Zurcher
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by Erik Zurcher » Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:51 pm

Casa Benelly/Max Guitars in the Hague has 11 Bernabé guitars in stock* (prices from €1300-13.500)

*according their website.
Reedition Domingo Esteso by Conde Hermanos 2004; Kenny Hill, model Barcelona 2001
"While you try to master classical guitar, prepare for a slave's life: the guitar will forever be your master and you its slave".

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eno
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by eno » Mon Apr 10, 2017 3:05 am

segobreawill wrote:Bernabe guitars have always been higher priced it seems. The money spent on a mere M5 or M10 can "get you more guitar" from another maker. I have looked at Bernabe guitars now for several years as I've slowly made up a list of which guitars I would like to have for my price bracket. Unfortunately, they are so expensive that I cannot go any further than an M10 - should I decide to go towards a Bernabe. This seems ridiculous to me to spend $4k US on a model that is only the second up in its line! There are better options for Spanish guitars thankfully.

I understand full well your dilemma and desire to own a Bernabe. But, the ridiculously higher price one has to pay, which seems to be mostly for the Bernabe name, is too much to stomach - not just for me but others as well that have already made comments concerning the high price of Bernabe guitars.
Well, there is a reason for higher prices of Bernabe guitars, it's not just brand name. When I was seraching for my upgrade guitar I tried a large number of guitars by many famous luthiers, both modern and older, and my final choice was Bernabe. The reason is a very special sound of Bernabe guitars. Not all people like it, to some people it sounds "metallic", but it depends on how you play it and what strings you use and what repertoire and musical period you prefer. Bernabe guitars have a bit of "lute" sweet sound in it so they are great for Baroque or Renaissance music and also sound great for most modern Spanish and contemporary music but may not be so good for romantic period music, so this is a matter of personal preference. For me the sound of my Bernabe absolutely blows me away. For the money I paid it was the best giutar to my taste that I could possibly buy.

But my advice: if possible and if the budget allows get a Bernabe guitar made personally by Bernabe Sr (father). All Bernabe guitars are great but the ones made by the Bernabe Sr still sound quite better compared to lower grade guitars made in other workshops by their specs or in their workshop by apprentices (the way they do lower grade models). If a Bernabe guitar is 10-20yrs old and has a PB stamp on the label than it was most likely made (at least partially) by Bernabe Sr, and if it's older than 25-30ysr and has PB stamp then is was definitely made personally by him. You can buy a lowest grade used Bernabe still with PB stamp for around $5K and IMHO a guitar made by Bernabe Sr for $5k is a gift. Good luck finding a Hauser II of Bouchet for $5K :D, but Bernabe is one of the greatest luthiers of 20th century quite comparable with Hauser, Ramirez, Fleta or Bouchet.

But even if you can't afford $5K then I think a used guitar is still a better choice than a new one because you can get a higher grade guitar for the same price and because usually the sound improves over the years.

I made a list of professional guitarists that have or had Brnabe Guitars (the collection of Lagoya guitars pretty much represents the top range of the luthiers except for lacking a Hauser):

Alexandre Lagoya, France -
* Jose Ramirez, Spain, 1968, N° 2784, "JF" signed (José Flores Duró)
* Dieter Hopf, Germany, La Portentosa model
Paulino Bernabé, Spain
Robert Bouchet, France
Ignacio Fleta, Spain
Masaru Kohno, Japan
Jose Ramirez III, Spain, 1969, N° 3133 not signed
Daniel Friederich, France, N° 414, 1975

Narcisco Yepes (1927-1997), Spain -
-10-strings Paulino Bernabé, Spain
Jose Ramirez III, Spain

Cristina Azuma, Brazil -
* Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 2007, concert model, spruce

Jan Depreter, Belgium -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1995, spruce (sold)

Graham Anthony Devine, UK
Paulino Bernabe, Spain

Valérie Duchâteau, France -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain for studio recording

Johan Fostier, Belgium -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, M30, cedar (sold)

Kostas Grigoreas, Greece -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1983, spruce

Norbert Kraft, Canada -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1997

Martha Masters, USA -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain

Charles Mokotoff, USA -
Paulino Bernabe, Spain

Stephan Schmidt, Germany -
- 10-strings:
Paulino Bernabé (1981), used for Maurice Ohana's guitar work recording
Paulino Bernabé (1982)

Jouni Stenroos, Finland -
Paulino Bernabe, Spain, 1985, spruce/Brazilian

Marc Teicholz, USA -
Paulino Bernabé

Sharon Wayne, USA -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1995, Modelo India, spruce

Johanna Beisteiner
Paulino Bernabé
Paulino Bernabe 'India' 2001
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tmblweed1
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by tmblweed1 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:09 am

eno wrote:
segobreawill wrote:Bernabe guitars have always been higher priced it seems. The money spent on a mere M5 or M10 can "get you more guitar" from another maker. I have looked at Bernabe guitars now for several years as I've slowly made up a list of which guitars I would like to have for my price bracket. Unfortunately, they are so expensive that I cannot go any further than an M10 - should I decide to go towards a Bernabe. This seems ridiculous to me to spend $4k US on a model that is only the second up in its line! There are better options for Spanish guitars thankfully.

I understand full well your dilemma and desire to own a Bernabe. But, the ridiculously higher price one has to pay, which seems to be mostly for the Bernabe name, is too much to stomach - not just for me but others as well that have already made comments concerning the high price of Bernabe guitars.
Well, there is a reason for higher prices of Bernabe guitars, it's not just brand name. When I was seraching for my upgrade guitar I tried a large number of guitars by many famous luthiers, both modern and older, and my final choice was Bernabe. The reason is a very special sound of Bernabe guitars. Not all people like it, to some people it sounds "metallic", but it depends on how you play it and what strings you use and what repertoire and musical period you prefer. Bernabe guitars have a bit of "lute" sweet sound in it so they are great for Baroque or Renaissance music and also sound great for most modern Spanish and contemporary music but may not be so good for romantic period music, so this is a matter of personal preference. For me the sound of my Bernabe absolutely blows me away. For the money I paid it was the best giutar to my taste that I could possibly buy.

But my advice: if possible and if the budget allows get a Bernabe guitar made personally by Bernabe Sr (father). All Bernabe guitars are great but the ones made by the Bernabe Sr still sound quite better compared to lower grade guitars made in other workshops by their specs or in their workshop by apprentices (the way they do lower grade models). If a Bernabe guitar is 10-20yrs old and has a PB stamp on the label than it was most likely made (at least partially) by Bernabe Sr, and if it's older than 25-30ysr and has PB stamp then is was definitely made personally by him. You can buy a lowest grade used Bernabe still with PB stamp for around $5K and IMHO a guitar made by Bernabe Sr for $5k is a gift. Good luck finding a Hauser II of Bouchet for $5K :D, but Bernabe is one of the greatest luthiers of 20th century quite comparable with Hauser, Ramirez, Fleta or Bouchet.

But even if you can't afford $5K then I think a used guitar is still a better choice than a new one because you can get a higher grade guitar for the same price and because usually the sound improves over the years.

I made a list of professional guitarists that have or had Brnabe Guitars (the collection of Lagoya guitars pretty much represents the top range of the luthiers except for lacking a Hauser):

Alexandre Lagoya, France -
* Jose Ramirez, Spain, 1968, N° 2784, "JF" signed (José Flores Duró)
* Dieter Hopf, Germany, La Portentosa model
Paulino Bernabé, Spain
Robert Bouchet, France
Ignacio Fleta, Spain
Masaru Kohno, Japan
Jose Ramirez III, Spain, 1969, N° 3133 not signed
Daniel Friederich, France, N° 414, 1975

Narcisco Yepes (1927-1997), Spain -
-10-strings Paulino Bernabé, Spain
Jose Ramirez III, Spain

Cristina Azuma, Brazil -
* Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 2007, concert model, spruce

Jan Depreter, Belgium -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1995, spruce (sold)

Graham Anthony Devine, UK
Paulino Bernabe, Spain

Valérie Duchâteau, France -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain for studio recording

Johan Fostier, Belgium -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, M30, cedar (sold)

Kostas Grigoreas, Greece -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1983, spruce

Norbert Kraft, Canada -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1997

Martha Masters, USA -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain

Charles Mokotoff, USA -
Paulino Bernabe, Spain

Stephan Schmidt, Germany -
- 10-strings:
Paulino Bernabé (1981), used for Maurice Ohana's guitar work recording
Paulino Bernabé (1982)

Jouni Stenroos, Finland -
Paulino Bernabe, Spain, 1985, spruce/Brazilian

Marc Teicholz, USA -
Paulino Bernabé

Sharon Wayne, USA -
Paulino Bernabé, Spain, 1995, Modelo India, spruce

Johanna Beisteiner
Paulino Bernabé
I agree 100%, once I had my Model 10 and Model 30 Bernabes my other 2 guitars (very nice ones) hardly ever left their case and were eventually sold.
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

beanctr
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by beanctr » Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:05 pm

How come the Bernabes on the Savino site have string beads or balls? Is that how they come from the factory? R
"Guitar Hobbyist"

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tmblweed1
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by tmblweed1 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 1:01 am

beanctr wrote:How come the Bernabes on the Savino site have string beads or balls? Is that how they come from the factory? R

He has them made and recommends them on his guitars. I use them, they come with the guitar. Of course you do not have to use them. Email Gianni at Savino guitars. He knows Mr Bernabe and can answer your questions fully. Or email Bernabe himself, he uasually writes back very quickly.
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

Podobin
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by Podobin » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:59 am

Aren't these lower model Bernabes actually made in factories in Valencia? I have been looking at these and the Teodoro Perez guitars, and can't seem to get a straight story of where and how the lower level models are made. There does not seem to be a lot of transparency in this segment of the market. Same with Pavan guitars, they come from some mystical facility in Spain. As far as we know, these Bernabe's can be marked up Adalids or whatever... sorry, but I find this aspect of the classical guitar business a bit shady.

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Allister Slingenberg
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by Allister Slingenberg » Wed Apr 19, 2017 8:01 am

I have a Berbabe M40 for sale on thios site! Trust me, it's better than going for a new one. I live in R'dam so you welcome to try it.
Groeten, Allister

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tmblweed1
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by tmblweed1 » Thu Apr 20, 2017 5:19 am

Podobin wrote:Aren't these lower model Bernabes actually made in factories in Valencia? I have been looking at these and the Teodoro Perez guitars, and can't seem to get a straight story of where and how the lower level models are made. There does not seem to be a lot of transparency in this segment of the market. Same with Pavan guitars, they come from some mystical facility in Spain. As far as we know, these Bernabe's can be marked up Adalids or whatever... sorry, but I find this aspect of the classical guitar business a bit shady.
Find his website and email to ask Mr Bernabe himself.
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

michaelquek
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by michaelquek » Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:08 pm

Hi
I owned Bernabe -Especial. Make no mistake about it; IMO and this an excellent representation of Spanish sound (and the soul) that brings me with great joy and tears when I played Triste by Antonio Carlos Jobim...what nostalgia.

If you examine Bernabe-Especial, the design and the wood is more than 20 years old. Bernabe himself is also the President of Spain Guitar Club and I think a percentage of his guitar sales is donated into the club in Madrid. That is his forte.

It cost about 9200 Euro after discount and it include a certificate from Bernabe about the guitar. I think I would have bought the Bernabe -Royal which is the top model but it is too expensive. I bought it from the Guitarrasdeluthier in Madrid, Spain from Sales person Miguel.

I also bought Paco Santiago Marin -30th Anniversary because of Ricardo Gallen (he owns 30th and 40th Anniversary model) and he played with it in the concert hall during Tampere guitar festival in 2016. I spoke to him personally...both guitars are very good...one of those best luthiers in Spain..today. Do take my word for it, just try and let us know. Cheers
I am your friend, new guitar player and need your advise

Podobin
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by Podobin » Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:42 pm

Well, I wrote to the email on his website with my queries, and no answer....yet.

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tmblweed1
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Re: Best place to buy a new (Bernabé) guitar

Post by tmblweed1 » Wed May 10, 2017 2:30 am

Podobin wrote:
Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:42 pm
Well, I wrote to the email on his website with my queries, and no answer....yet.
what can I say, I guess I was lucky to hear back maybe? its well known he does not personally make all his guitars but, as many others do, has people he trusts to make the lesser ones.
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

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