Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Carlos
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by Carlos » Sat May 06, 2017 2:00 pm

florestan wrote:
Sat May 06, 2017 1:38 pm
I appreciate all the information and reassurances from those who reached out, and especially from Carlos! :merci: Without whom I would still be wondering what to think. You are a true gentleman!
You´re welcome! I am glad to see that you are reassured, and thank you as well for your kind words. I am happy that I could be bring a contribution to maintain the gentleness of our delcamp community :-)

florestan
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by florestan » Sat May 06, 2017 4:03 pm

bacsidoan wrote:
Sat May 06, 2017 1:43 pm
I hate to tell you this, but if you send the preemptive Lacey paperwork, you will be charged with a $44 Lacey processing fee :x
Really? Where/when is the fee normally assessed? I didn't have to pay a fee on the Stenzel...but at the time I didn't know about the different forms and only submitted paperwork once the guitar got held up in customs.
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florestan
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by florestan » Sat May 06, 2017 4:06 pm

florestan wrote:
Sat May 06, 2017 4:03 pm
bacsidoan wrote:
Sat May 06, 2017 1:43 pm
I hate to tell you this, but if you send the preemptive Lacey paperwork, you will be charged with a $44 Lacey processing fee :x
Really? Where/when is the fee normally assessed? I didn't have to pay a fee on the Stenzel...but at the time I didn't know about the different forms and only submitted paperwork once the guitar got held up in customs.
Just realized I haven't actually gotten the customs bill from FedEx yet; which would probably explain why I haven't seen the fee....
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bacsidoan
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by bacsidoan » Sat May 06, 2017 4:43 pm

florestan wrote:
Sat May 06, 2017 4:03 pm
bacsidoan wrote:
Sat May 06, 2017 1:43 pm
I hate to tell you this, but if you send the preemptive Lacey paperwork, you will be charged with a $44 Lacey processing fee :x
Really? Where/when is the fee normally assessed? I didn't have to pay a fee on the Stenzel...but at the time I didn't know about the different forms and only submitted paperwork once the guitar got held up in customs.
That's the point. If you don't submit the Lacey form, there's a good chance that the US Customs agent does not know anything about it, and you only have to pay the duty fee. On the other hand, if you encounter a sticky agent, then there will be another delay :wink:

florestan
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by florestan » Sat May 06, 2017 5:12 pm

Yeah, that makes sense, though I think I would rather pay the fee and hope it doesn't get stuck for long in customs.

When purchasing a guitar (or anything for that matter) from Europe there is this initial feeling of joy when you see the VAT deducted from the purchase price of the instrument. It feels like you are getting a great deal or discount. It's easy to forget that you will likely pick up allot of that cost on the back end of the shipment. Every time I go to the mail box I expect to see an envelope from FedEx including customs charges + their fees.

Sometime it's hard to remember all the costs that can dramatically increase the final price of the guitar (e.g., wire transfer fees, bank or credit card fees, shipping and customs fees...). It add's up quickly!
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Podobin
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by Podobin » Sun May 07, 2017 7:52 pm

If you hand carry the guitar from the EU to the USA does one have to pay duty?? I have heard that it can come across as a "personal item" and that it does not need to be declared. I am currently considering this as I have a family member traveling from EU to USA at the end of this month. Any input on this??

florestan
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by florestan » Sun May 07, 2017 8:48 pm

Podobin wrote:
Sun May 07, 2017 7:52 pm
If you hand carry the guitar from the EU to the USA does one have to pay duty?? I have heard that it can come across as a "personal item" and that it does not need to be declared. I am currently considering this as I have a family member traveling from EU to USA at the end of this month. Any input on this??
I think this is a very grey area. I don't know the answer definitively...BUT legally, my guess is that it is supposed to be declared since it was an item purchased in the EU, and is technically being imported into the US. That said, I don't see how this could be enforced by customs without you first declaring that fact to them. That is, I don't see how else customs could know that the item was being imported, and not already your personal property from before, or gifted to you, etc.

Even for items being sent from Europe to the US by courier, customs depends on a declaration form before assessing any sort of duty; and that assessment is dependent on the declaration made by the sender.

I found this sample declaration form online:

https://www.cbp.gov/travel/us-citizens/ ... ation-form

I think the key items in your case are #'s 14 & 15

14. Mark an X in the Yes or No box. Are you or any family members traveling with you bringing commercial merchandise into the United States? Examples: all articles intended to be sold or left in the United States, samples used for soliciting orders, or goods that are not considered personal effects.

15. If you are a U.S. resident, print the total value of all goods (including commercial merchandise) you or any family members traveling with you have purchased or acquired abroad (including gifts for someone else, but not items mailed to the United States) and are bringing into the United States.


#14 gets back to the "personal item" of your question: "articles intended to be sold or left in the United States, samples used for soliciting orders, or goods that are not considered personal effects."

The grey area!

As a side note, 15 actually says you are supposed to declare gifts as well...though am pretty sure that duties are not assessed on those....
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bacsidoan
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by bacsidoan » Sun May 07, 2017 11:02 pm

I do not think that is is a grey area, but just plain illegal. People do this quite often and get away with it the vast majority of the time.

florestan
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by florestan » Mon May 08, 2017 1:00 am

bacsidoan wrote:
Sun May 07, 2017 11:02 pm
I do not think that is is a grey area, but just plain illegal. People do this quite often and get away with it the vast majority of the time.
Ok, so yes, maybe more black and white than grey....
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lagartija
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by lagartija » Mon May 08, 2017 1:31 am

Definitely NOT a gray area! Anything you have purchased or was gifted to you must be declared at Customs.
As a citizen, you have an exemption of a certain dollar amount. (IIRC, somewhere around $800) If it was a gift, you may estimate the value to the best of your ability. Not declaring it is a violation of the law.
The duty that must be paid depends on the item. Some items have little or no duty, some have a higher duty. Once you have listed your items on the declaration, the customs official will help you determine the duty owed if any. It has been my experience that honesty is the best policy. When I came back from a trip to Asia, carrying a variety of items, I carefully listed them all. The customs officer put the items having the highest duty under my exemption, and when all was said and done, I think I owed something like $12 on $2500 dollars of stuff.
You can look up the duty on a handmade instrument... it may not be that high and certainly it is not worth the risk of smuggling the item into the country. If caught, you pay penalties and may have the item confiscated.
Here is a link to the Customs page. It depends upon the country of origin. There may be *no* duty at all, or as much as 40% if you are buying it from North Korea for import into the US!
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Podobin
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by Podobin » Mon May 08, 2017 3:12 am

How would customs know the difference between a €500 guitar and a €3000 one? Not sure how savvy they are....someone indicated to me to carry in as a personal item.

simonm
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by simonm » Mon May 08, 2017 7:13 am

Podobin wrote:
Mon May 08, 2017 3:12 am
How would customs know the difference between a €500 guitar and a €3000 one? Not sure how savvy they are....someone indicated to me to carry in as a personal item.
I am sure that one or two customs officers in the US have figured out how to use google by now. :-)

I was in a customs office here paying some tax on timber I got from Canada. It was an open plan office. One official thought the declared price of some leather jackets (from Hong Kong) looked rather low. Quick google search, confirmed opinion and so passed the invoice to their investigating team instead of just send out the tax bill.

But as far as guitars go, if you are carrying it as a personal item, I doubt if they would be in the slightest bit interested whether it is a 500 or 3000 item. On the other hand if it is a violin and it is 250,000 or 1,000,000 they might be very interested indeed. In Europe that would have you liable to 50,000 or 200,000 sales tax respectively. (EU sales tax is 20% round numbers).
Last edited by simonm on Sat May 13, 2017 8:30 am, edited 2 times in total.

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lagartija
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by lagartija » Mon May 08, 2017 12:59 pm

Podobin wrote:
Mon May 08, 2017 3:12 am
How would customs know the difference between a €500 guitar and a €3000 one? Not sure how savvy they are....someone indicated to me to carry in as a personal item.
That "someone" obviously cares little if you are fined, jailed or your item is confiscated.
Your call.
When the sun shines, bask.
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Classical Guitar forever!

Podobin
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by Podobin » Mon May 08, 2017 4:23 pm

Identity of "someone" will remain confidential. Let's just say it is someone active in the classical guitar world.

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zupfgeiger
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Re: Siccas Guitars, experiences?

Post by zupfgeiger » Mon May 08, 2017 10:12 pm

BTW my experience with Siccas guitars is absolutely positive.
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Tobias Braun, Santos copy, spruce/yew, 2017
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