Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Mr.Rain
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by Mr.Rain » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:10 pm

tmblweed1 wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:34 pm
Mr.Rain wrote:
Sat Sep 16, 2017 10:51 pm
tmblweed1 wrote:
Sat Sep 16, 2017 6:05 pm

Angel is the head luthier and he signed my Model 60, unless things have changed. Mr Picado has not built guitars in several years.
Yes, Angel is the head luthier, Don Antonio is retired, he passed the workshop to Angel and Carlos(They are both Partners in the workshop, doing Carlos a lot of business related work while Angel is the head luthier)

AFAIK Angel builds all the conciertos (as a one man process), will ask him next time we talk, about the 60s,not sure if currently he still builds them as one man process or assisted by the other luthiers (that would explain the lack of signature on the heel block), Still I think he is the one making the tops ...
I am considering a 2005 Model 62, cedar and Brazilian . No signature, just Antonio Picado 62 on the label. Who do you think the builder likely was??
Agreeing with Jacek in both things (it should have been built by Angel)
Could you post the picture of the guitar and the label ? or send it to Picado to double check?.

I never seen any Concierto/62 Picado unsigned (only their lower studio models unsigned), but they will know if this is possible or not.
I kindly suggest you to reach them (to be sure if it is a really a Picado 62, and who built it)

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Jacek A. Rochacki
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by Jacek A. Rochacki » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:23 pm

- I agree with Mr. Rain, I have also did not see nor heard of Picado of higher class that would be unsigned at the "normal"/standard Picado label; the more my curiosity to take a look at the label of this Picado 2005 model 62 guitar grows.
Antonio Picado, model 60, 2015, Cedar/IRW. Scale 640 mm.
Kenny Hill, model Madrid, 2002, No. 2019, Cedar/IRW. Scale 650 mm.

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tmblweed1
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by tmblweed1 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:03 pm

I have requested a picture and will post hopefully soon
Because it seems strange
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

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tmblweed1
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by tmblweed1 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:44 pm

this is the guitar, pretty sure that is Brazilian and the front looks Picado, still waiting on the label pic
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As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

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Jacek A. Rochacki
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by Jacek A. Rochacki » Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:56 am

- just for comparison with my model 60: details of back
My Picado back detail.JPG
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Antonio Picado, model 60, 2015, Cedar/IRW. Scale 640 mm.
Kenny Hill, model Madrid, 2002, No. 2019, Cedar/IRW. Scale 650 mm.

Mr.Rain
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by Mr.Rain » Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:26 am

HI Guys,

I just talked to Angel a bit ago, he was saying they always signed higher models(but sometimes put no date). He said there is an slight possibility for a 2005 guitar of having no label, if it was commissioned by an USA shop.

When selling to some shops they used to send extra labels, as there was sometimes issue with the original labels(damage/cites permissions info needing to be added), so it could be replaced at the shop.

Still he suggested to check the block or the inside of the guitar for initials (AP, AG or dated signature) that will clear out the doubts,and to share the pictures.

He warned me as he said there are some fake guitarras around, but he said it was easy to spot the fake ones... (in this case it seems legit, but he would like to give a look to the pictures )

Regarding the 60 models, he said he used to make those ones as one man operation (head to toes) till 2011-2012, later he started being helped by other of the luthiers at the shop, most of the time helped by others (doing him a bigger or a smaller part on each of these guitars)

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tmblweed1
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by tmblweed1 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:33 pm

Picture including the case, will ask him to check the headblock
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As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

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dta721
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by dta721 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:39 pm

Jacek A. Rochacki wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:56 am
- just for comparison with my model 60: details of back
My Picado back detail.JPG
I am just curious about the mahogany neck reinforced with ebony, how significant is this feature?

Mr.Rain
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by Mr.Rain » Wed Sep 20, 2017 3:19 pm

dta721 wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:39 pm
Jacek A. Rochacki wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:56 am
- just for comparison with my model 60: details of back
My Picado back detail.JPG
I am just curious about the mahogany neck reinforced with ebony, how significant is this feature?
All the necks in Picado are made of Honduran Cedar (AFAIK they do not use mahogany,even on the cheapest studio models, it is cedar).
All the models over the 60 have the ebony stripe, like many other guitars, in theory to make the neck stronger (I had several lower models without it, no real difference, still the carbon rods in their concierto could be a real difference).

Mr.Rain
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by Mr.Rain » Wed Sep 20, 2017 3:29 pm

tmblweed1 wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:33 pm
Picture including the case, will ask him to check the headblock
The heel block is rounded(as it should be), the rosette/tie block seem to be the real 62.

The more pictures you post the clearer it looks...

try to Get a picture of the label, and asking the guy where he go it from... :contrat:

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tmblweed1
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by tmblweed1 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:27 pm

I have the label pic, it is signed by Angel. It looked like part of the label to him. I will post it later
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

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tmblweed1
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by tmblweed1 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:58 pm

this should clear up the confusion, thanks for your help guys
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As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

Mr.Rain
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2016 4:43 pm
Location: Dublin

Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by Mr.Rain » Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:35 am

I think that's Don Antonio signature, all seems fine :)

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keithwwk
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by keithwwk » Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:39 am

It look more like Master Antonio Picado autograph...:)
Antonio Picado Model 60 Spruce 2017
M.Sakurai No.5 Cedar 1976
Yamaha G225

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tmblweed1
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Re: Antonio Picado 62 vs. Ramirez 4NE vs. Esteve 11 vs. Alhambra 11p Cedar

Post by tmblweed1 » Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:50 am

Well then that takes it up a notch!!
As soon as you see something, you already start to intellectualize it. As soon as you intellectualize something, it is no longer what you saw.
Shunryu Suzuki-roshi 1905 1971

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