Can't Find My Guitar

Skip Ellis
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Location: Sarasota, FL USA

Can't Find My Guitar

Post by Skip Ellis » Sun Sep 24, 2017 11:55 pm

Hi all! Haven't been around much lately but I need some help/advice on finding a guitar that fits my needs and I cannot afford a luthier built instrument and I'm not sure anyone (production companies) makes what I want. I've approached Cordoba but they've pretty much blown me off. I want a flamenco negra style guitar with a lower neck set for better action, a cutaway, NO electronics, ebony fingerboard, and, a cedar top with rosewood back and sides. Top wood would not be a deal breaker - spruce would be OK, too, but would prefer cedar. I play finger style pop, jazz, celtic, ragtime and, yes, even a little classical. I do not use pickups and prefer a good microphone. I generally play in small venues at assisted living facilities for small groups of not more than 25-35 people. I realize that there are a lot of 'fusion' type instruments out there that would probably fit the bill but I just don't want a nice guitar with a bunch of electronics cut into the side of it. Any advice on finding what I want? Thanks!!

Laudiesdad69
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by Laudiesdad69 » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:13 pm

What's your budget, and where do you Live? Tell us that and I'm sure there will be many recommendations from many people.

Skip Ellis
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Location: Sarasota, FL USA

Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by Skip Ellis » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:42 pm

Budget $1200 +/-. I live in Florida USA

doralikesmath
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by doralikesmath » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:57 am

If you don't mind the potential troubles, you can get a luthier made guitar to your required specs from China or Southeast Asia with your budget. Other than that I think it would be hard to get a readily available guitar with that much details.
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dta721
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by dta721 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:42 pm

doralikesmath wrote:
Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:57 am
... I think it would be hard to get a readily available guitar with that much details.
My 2 cents: it's not the details, rather the conflicting requirements for such a "fusion" guitar to exist! Thus, if the OP can split the requirements into two sets, two guitars can be found! :)

Skip Ellis
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by Skip Ellis » Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:25 pm

Don't want a fusion guitar. Want a normal classical width fingerboard (ebony), cedar top, cutaway, and low action. Shouldn't be so hard.

OldPotter
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by OldPotter » Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:12 pm

Don't want a fusion guitar. Want a normal classical width fingerboard (ebony), cedar top, cutaway, and low action. Shouldn't be so hard
Then a Hirade TH5C or Takamine equivalent and just don't switch on the electronics. If you really want to remove the preamp then it could be taken out and a bent wood insert installed. It wont change the sound and in my own opinion is not worth the effort. I have heard one of these being played numerous times, sometimes through an AER and many times on its own. Depending on the particular guitar and player it can sound extremely good.
You might have to find a used one, I don't see them advertised as much these days.
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MrF1
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by MrF1 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:09 pm

Skip Ellis wrote:
Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:25 pm
Don't want a fusion guitar. Want a normal classical width fingerboard (ebony), cedar top, cutaway, and low action. Shouldn't be so hard.
Skip....the difficult feature is the cutaway....usually only found on the "fusion" crossovers. Here's an idea. Kenny Hill offers a New World 650 cedar classical with an elevated fret board, which might meet your need to reach the upper frets. I happen to know that Larry Darnell has one right now (he works for KH and has a web page called The Handmade) that is b-stock. List on the elevated model is usually around $2.6K, but you can probably score it at a substantial discount. Will probably be higher than 1,200, but hopefully not too far over your target budget. I own a New World 650 Spruce that I bought from Larry...it was a damaged-in-transit guitar, but the repair was done at the Hill shop and it's one of the best guitars I own. Just an idea....

Fred

Skip Ellis
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by Skip Ellis » Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:16 pm

OldPotter: that is a possibility but I don' t like looking down and seeing all that crap stuck in the side of my guitar. I think that was why I sold my Cordoba GK Studio - pretty nice guitar for the price but I prefer a wider neck and most pure classical guitars don't provide enough saddle to lower the action to my requirements. With high tension strings, I think an action of 2mm on the treble and 3.5mm on the bass should be possible on any guitar without cutting the saddle all the way down to the bridge and losing a good break angle. I don't understand why more builders won't take into account that some players want lower action. I know some (most?) true classical players want high action but some of us like the sound of nylon strings but want lower action. There should be a point where one could have both. Why not build them to where the action can be lowered by installing a different saddle. I know I'm tilting at windmills here but it's frustrating to not be able to find what you want.

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SeanWinkler
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by SeanWinkler » Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:24 pm

Closest I can think of would be a nylon string Selmer/Maccaferri style D-hole. Gitane makes one, model DG560, that's pretty close to your specs but with cypress back/sides. I know I've seen something similar with rosewood, but I can't recall if it was a custom build vs. factory.
Remember Anthony Weller, please help. Contact myself or Aaron Green for details.

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SeanWinkler
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by SeanWinkler » Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:39 pm

Also, Pavan TP-20-AC. Not sure if the setup and neck angle are what you're looking for, though.
Remember Anthony Weller, please help. Contact myself or Aaron Green for details.

Skip Ellis
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Location: Sarasota, FL USA

Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by Skip Ellis » Tue Sep 26, 2017 7:07 pm

SeanWInkler: actually there is a beautiful Pavan flamenco negra that can be ordered with a cutaway but it's out of my price range. I used to own a TP-30 - it was a wonderful guitar - I could be tempted to own another if I could find a good used one.

OldPotter
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by OldPotter » Tue Sep 26, 2017 7:25 pm

I think an action of 2mm on the treble and 3.5mm on the bass
I have a TH5 without the cutaway, from memory it has 2.6mm on the treble, can't remember the bass, but around 3.5mm. Its not the break angle that is the limiting factor, more the worry about fret buzz. But anyway its low enough for me. My ex teacher has had 2 or 3 TH5Cs and still has 2 and now a TH90. Just my personal opinion but I think they make good working guitars. He can certainly get a good sound from these and also likes to lower the saddle so that he can play for several hours.

I just don't look at the electronics panel, I don't normally perform....but in fact I think its useful, just to add a little to the volume.

Just something to be wary of, my own guitar has a wolf note on 3rd fret d on the second string.
"When I was younger, I could remember almost everything, whether it happened or not." Mark Twain

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SeanWinkler
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by SeanWinkler » Wed Sep 27, 2017 1:50 pm

SeanWinkler wrote:
Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:24 pm
Closest I can think of would be a nylon string Selmer/Maccaferri style D-hole. Gitane makes one, model DG560, that's pretty close to your specs but with cypress back/sides. I know I've seen something similar with rosewood, but I can't recall if it was a custom build vs. factory.
I may have been thinking of the Aria MM-85D/N. This is a nylon string Maccaferri style with spruce/rosewood. It has a 48mm nut width, though, so maybe not quite what you want, either.
Remember Anthony Weller, please help. Contact myself or Aaron Green for details.

lux
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Re: Can't Find My Guitar

Post by lux » Wed Sep 27, 2017 10:23 pm

For a long time I was looking for a similar instrument. Cutaway bodies tend to have three characteristics that come along with them: 1. acoustic-electric platform (often with shallower bodies), 2. laminated construction, 3. nut widths in the 47-50mm range.

Obviously most of these instruments are made for steel-string players who are "crossing over." The one company I found that did make acoustic-electric cutaways with solid-wood construction in a true classical format with a 52mm nut width was the Yamaha NCX series (NTX is the crossover variant). The NCX1200R has a street price of about a thousand bucks and many have proclaimed it to be a great value for the kind of build it is. I've never played one, but its acoustic-only sound has been reported as quite good. Gabriela Quintero of the duo "Rodrigo and Gabriela" plays one. It does have the on-board pickup system with that equalizer panel just above the waist, though.

Do you want a cutaway guitar specifically for playing barre chords above 10th position, or are you just attracted to the jazzier look? Read this thread before you buy one:viewtopic.php?t=11208

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