3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Laudiesdad69
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3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Laudiesdad69 » Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:49 pm

I just bought another Lucero. I had a LC150sce and a LC200S and wound up giving them to my son and my daughter in law. Well, I needed another travel guitar, so I bought another LC200S. The workmanship on these guitars is every bit as good as my old Cordoba C9, and the fret job is better.

There are no frets poking out the edges of the fretboard. No uneven frets. The neck angle is right. The nut height at the slots is good, and I didn't have to monkey around with the saddle as it has a good action of 4/3 at the 12th. I compared it to a Kremona FC65 Fiesta model, and the tone and action were quite similar. Both with Cedar tops and lam rosewood b/s.

I can't say enough about this brand. They are made for Guitar Center/Musician's Friend. The LC200S is the only model that is really a CG with 52mm nut. And for less than $ 200, it is practically a free guitar. I would suggest to anyone looking for a very inexpensive CG to try one of these. It is the most "Bang" for the buck out there, and compares favorably to guitars in the $600 to $800 price range. I did have photos but they were too big to post.

MessyTendon
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by MessyTendon » Fri Oct 27, 2017 1:11 am

I just got a Brazilian Rosewood veneered Aria...I feel ya, some cheap guitars do sound nice. I paid 100$ for mine, the tuners will need to be repaired, the shafts are bent. I'm a cheap guy...so I'm likely going to re-button them and bend the shafts back in a bench vice.

If you actually look inside at the kerfing and bracing, it wouldn't surprise me if it's the same cookie cutter braces of the Cordoba line of guitars.

There is a slap em together mentality of factory guitars. That being said upper echelon factory guitars are more refined in voicing and response, and tonal variations.

I don't ever and will never recommend Cordoba anything. Two hundred dollars is not cheap to some people, in fact that would be considered an expensive guitar for somebody less fortunate.

So when it comes to cheaper guitars I never recommend chinese anything. If you want a pretty faux finish, sure get the chinese tinker toy.

If you want a real sweet bargain look at vintage Japanese guitars.

I have no problem believing you that the cheaper guitar is finished better than the more expensive models because they probably produce more models of that nature.

Quite honestly, I'd love to see the laminated cordoba sawn apart and the Lucero model. They look strikingly similar.

And no...absolutely do not believe it is a rosewood on rosewood lamination. It's going to be a 3 ply...outer rosewood, inner white wood of some sort and another veneer.

I say that because I thought my vintage Aria would be solid laminate construction when in fact it is 3 ply. Still it sounds nice and looks good.

Sadly there is too much fluff surrounding midrange factory guitars. Most of them are the same guitar with an upcharge on questionable wood.


If it features exotic wood and has a low price you can be it's laminated in three pieces...nothing wrong with that, but it should called 3 ply...not rosewood or mahogany which is most likely sapelle or a variant.

I get so peeved to see people suggestiong 500-900$ Cordoba products when you can get the same guitar for 200$

Good on you for being honest. It's not that the upper tiered Cordoba guitars are terrible, but they just aren't that good :)

Laudiesdad69
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Laudiesdad69 » Fri Oct 27, 2017 2:03 am

MessyTendon wrote:
Fri Oct 27, 2017 1:11 am


I don't ever and will never recommend Cordoba anything. Two hundred dollars is not cheap to some people, in fact that would be considered an expensive guitar for somebody less fortunate.



If it features exotic wood and has a low price you can be it's laminated in three pieces...nothing wrong with that, but it should called 3 ply...not rosewood or mahogany
Yeah Messy, I'm sure it is three ply b/s. I suppose I shouldn't have said it was a practically free guitar, as somewhere out in the world, in some other country, 200 bucks is a lot of money. And as I am a poor person, I just meant that the quality of the guitar for such a low price is unbeatable, although, it is nothing like my Ramirez. It sounds better than my C9, and again at a fraction of the price. It's good enough for me to travel around with. But that's it for me for guitars for a long time. As I am now one of the less fortunate.

The playability was there right out of the box. I have yet to meet a Cordoba that gets it right strait out of the box. I will never recommend any Cordoba guitar, as I've had too many that sucked. But when you are starting out in CG, sometimes you just don't know any better.

The only attention that the guitar required was smoothing out the d string nut slot as it was binding when tuning up the string. That was it. It's definitely a good enough guitar for a beginner to intermediate player, and it won't break the bank. I see a lot of beginners go down the Cordoba road, and it's a shame. Their guitars will eventually need to have cracks repaired, and Cordoba is famous for that. People spent a lot of money on crappy guitars that were supposed to be good. I have been pleasantly surprised by what is supposed to be the lowest of low end guitars actually turning out to be an excellent value, for what it is anyway.

MessyTendon
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by MessyTendon » Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:27 am

All guitars can crack :) My was good guitar was not cheap at 1,000$. But to some that is cheap. But I've compared it to higher model Cordoba...the master series made right here in CA...and they still sound anemic.

I think the 200$ Lucida is most likely a re-badged cordoba, with a few less expensive features...such as wood...The tuners look suspiciously like my old Cordoba C5 which I gleeful smashed. I still have the neck.

It's easy for me to say a second hand Nagoya built guitar is going to be better sounding than any Cordoba...and in fact my old laminated top guitar to my ears sounded as good as many solid top Cordoba guitars.

I don't think Cordoba are bad guitars but the 300$ guitar to my ears ought to retail for 125$ and the 900-1500$ models ought to list for 300-500$.

Considering many vintage Japanese guitars retailed for roughly 100-500$...adjusted to inflation some of those 60's models are more like 500-900$.

Today's production guitars from China are more or less junk...There are exceptions. But considering the model you mention is featured at Guitar Center...it's not very good :) But that doesn't mean it's bad. It more solidifies my opinion that entry level Chinese guitars have a huge diminishing curve...Once you get past the 200$ mark, you are more or less paying for questionable "tonewood" and upgraded "solid wood" that doesn't necessarily mean quality.

Not to say all chinese guitars are junk. But the mass produced models generally denote a significant rip off as price increases :)

One of the many reasons I cherish vintage Japanese classicals is that they often featured a dovetail neck that can be re-set...and laminated models often were as nice sounding as solid models, it was just a luxury item.

Laudiesdad69
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Laudiesdad69 » Fri Oct 27, 2017 12:06 pm

MessyTendon wrote:
Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:27 am
All guitars can crack.

I don't think Cordoba are bad guitars but the 300$ guitar to my ears ought to retail for 125$ and the 900-1500$ models ought to list for 300-500.

Today's production guitars from China are more or less junk...There are exceptions. But considering the model you mention is featured at Guitar Center...it's not very good :)

Not to say all chinese guitars are junk.
Yes all guitars can crack, but of the 4 Cordobas I have owned, 3 came from the factory with cracks. I don’t think they are using properly seasoned wood. That or they are built in high humidity, and dry out after they have been shipped to the warehouse in the US. Like I said previously, when you are starting out, you really don’t know any better.

Comparing the Lucero to other guitars, like a good Ramirez, or Picado, the Lucero is junk. But, comparing it to other Chinese guitars, like Córdoba and even Kenny Hill New World Estudio, the Lucero is a great value because of the price. There was a used LC200S online that was $125. That says something about how little it costs to make a Chinese guitar. I paid $199 new for mine, and they are still making a decent profit. If I had paid a hundred dollars more, it wouldn’t have been much of a bargain, but still favors comparably to Chinese guitars in the 600 to 800 range. I guess that it is all relative.

The Lucero guitars are Guitar Center’s own brand, which in most cases means junk, but in this case I was pleasantly surprised. And, ant least with the few that I have purchased, they have been consistent in that they didn’t have problems. Although the woods used on these guitars isn’t high grade, there are no cracks, and they didn’t put that fake dark finish on the fingerboard (the kind that comes off on your fingers when you play).

Dave Stott
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Dave Stott » Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:22 pm

According to the Lucero website, their guitars are made in Asia. But most of the labels in the guitars that I've seen state "Made in Indonesia". They also refer to Samick, which I think used to be associated with Ibanez.

They seem to be nice, cheap laminate guitars for beginners.
2015 Cordoba GK Pro Negra
2015 Cordoba Solista Cedar
2003 H-12 Froggy Bottom
1989 Takamine E-30 Classical

SteveL123
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by SteveL123 » Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:06 pm

Indonesia is in Asia

Dave Stott
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Dave Stott » Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:29 pm

Lol. Yes, I'm aware of this.
2015 Cordoba GK Pro Negra
2015 Cordoba Solista Cedar
2003 H-12 Froggy Bottom
1989 Takamine E-30 Classical

Laudiesdad69
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Laudiesdad69 » Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:55 pm

Dave Stott wrote:
Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:22 pm
According to the Lucero website, their guitars are made in Asia. But most of the labels in the guitars that I've seen state "Made in Indonesia". They also refer to Samick, which I think used to be associated with Ibanez.

They seem to be nice, cheap laminate guitars for beginners.
The box that the guitar came in said China on it. This particular model has a solid Cedar top. Back and sides are laminated rosewood on the outside anyway. This guitar would get a beginner through their first year or two for sure.

madrilla
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by madrilla » Sat Oct 28, 2017 12:30 pm

Congrats on your guitar Laudiesdad.

The thing about the Cordoba C9 - C10 that bothers me, is they are called luthier series. If were no complaints about frets, finishing then I wouldn't question it. But since there have been bad experiences I think it is a bit deceitful.

Laudiesdad69
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Laudiesdad69 » Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:53 pm

madrilla wrote:
Sat Oct 28, 2017 12:30 pm
Congrats on your guitar Laudiesdad.

The thing about the Cordoba C9 - C10 that bothers me, is they are called luthier series. If were no complaints about frets, finishing then I wouldn't question it. But since there have been bad experiences I think it is a bit deceitful.
Yeah it's not like they are made by a true luthier. They are a factory item. I wonder what the per unit cost is on the C9 or the C10, to someone like Guitar Center. GC sells the C9 for around $850 new. Cordoba is something that happens to beginners that don't know any better... I was there once myself. I might try a C10 if I could get one at a bargain price. C10 is still Hella expensive for a Chinese guitar IMHO. And they will never be collected in the way that some Spanish brands are. I tend to think of Chinese guitars as tools. Like a Craftsman screwdriver. And while my Ramirez can still be considered a tool, it is more like Snap-on😲

Philosopherguy
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by Philosopherguy » Mon Oct 30, 2017 4:43 am

The Chinese are making some nice guitars these days! People used to say the same things about Japanese guitars too. I have played a number of higher end Martinez guitars and I used to have a Youlong Guo, all Chinese made and very nice sound. Cordoba's are likely just going through their growing pains right now with their spiking popularity and the large range of models (always a bad idea to have too many models.. quality slips).

Keep in mind there is also plenty of bad guitars that come from all around the world! hahaha.. Spain in the not so recent past also had its fair share of cheap guitars, along with other parts of Europe. It just happens to be cheaper to produce guitars in China right now. But, the cheap Chinese guitars are no worse than what used to be the cheap Spanish guitars or other cheap European made guitars. If anything, Chinese guitars have been a great boon to the industry. Back when I was younger, I think guitars were more expensive if you factor in inflation. Even for cheap guitars! Now, look at the kind of quality you can get for that kind of price. Heck, no one in North America could hardly get the materials to build a guitar for what these finished products are selling for by the time you factor in all the overhead costs.

If the Lucero is good and it plays half decently - count your blessings that you got a good one, or a couple, from a good lot.

Martin
*************************************************************
2013 Ramirez 130 Anos - Spruce
2013 Ramirez 4NE - Cedar
1998 Dean Harrington - Spruce
1977 Kuniharu Nobe - Spruce
1971 Yamaha GC3 - Spruce

madrilla
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by madrilla » Mon Oct 30, 2017 12:26 pm

I don't see made in China as inferior in itself. Actually I'm quite interested in the higher end Martinez.

I just question the direction that Cordoba takes. They call the C9/10 luthier series, they got a few good reviews, sell on all major online shops to get the widest possible coverage. Perhaps they ramp up production in China to keep up with demand and the quality on some of their output suffer as a result.

madrilla
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by madrilla » Mon Oct 30, 2017 12:27 pm

Double post

User avatar
dta721
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Re: 3rd Lucero...great value for under $200

Post by dta721 » Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:16 pm

madrilla wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 12:26 pm
... Perhaps they ramp up production in China to keep up with demand and the quality on some of their output suffer as a result.
Regardless where those guitars were made, if they have volume manufacturing, there would be quality process control in place, e.g. statistical process control, to ensure a consistent output. How you explained above simply points to poor quality control,IMO!

I think as Laudiesdad69 got "lucky" with a the 3rd Lucero in a row, being consistently good speaks volume to such quality process, even at such low cost (< $200 US). That said, who knows a few months from now they'd become like other brands, as soon as they establish a reputation, cost cutting for extra revenue kicks in, quality suffers?!

My 2 cents!

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