advice on P.B royal and especial

simonm
Amateur luthier
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Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 am
Location: Germany, Würzburg.

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by simonm » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:22 pm

Tapin wrote:... it seems P.B Royal is not so popular, maybe the price range is too expensive. Actually I just want an upgrade from my sakurai Pc model.
I did a search for the "sakurai Pc". I found two prices. $7,500 and $9,500. I have no experience of that model but just from a price and reputation perspective you already have a top class instrument. It no doubt has a specific Kohno style sound that may or may not be everybody's taste but it is a taste issue not a "better", "best" issue. When you are willing to spend above that range you have an almost unlimited choice. But unfortunately its like saying I want to spend between $125k and $250k on a car. You could buy a Bentley or a Ferrari: which is better? I have never sat in either so I have no idea (but I would buy a house somewhere instead anyway). Similarly with top end guitars: it is a very personal choice and requires the development of one's own taste.

If you have a clear vision of what type of music you want to play, and where (e.g. home, concert hall), then that might give some people here a hint as to what type of instrument to recommend as it maybe that certain music will work better on one type or another. Some of the people who have chimed in above have lots of experience with some of the best guitars in the world and understand the differences.

It would also be worthwhile to play some good but cheaper instruments to understand the differences. Look at a couple of instruments in the price range $1500 to $3500 and see what the differences are to your own.

Tom
Posts: 1352
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:40 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tom » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:33 pm

petermc61 wrote:
Tapin wrote:Thank you keithwwk, I'm considering greg smallman guitar also. Any comments and suggestions are welcome.
Smallman and Berbabe will sound nothing alike. I am rather confused what sort of guitar you are after.
+ 1... TS seems not sure what he is looking for.

quixilver
Posts: 282
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:22 am
Location: Indonesia / Singapore

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by quixilver » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:38 pm

Tapin wrote:Hi quixilver, I study guitar in Jakarta Guitar School, how about you? Are you study guitar in Jakarta too?
Do you mean SGJ under David Sylvester?

Tom
Posts: 1352
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:40 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tom » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:40 pm

Between Bernabe Royal, Imperial and Especial, the sound differernt is sometime insignificant. The only differnt is commercially they use better woods and more decorative on Royal and imperial to make them more expensive than Especial. That does not necessary mean Royal and Imperial sound better than Especial.

All for commercial reason.

Tapin
Posts: 25
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:07 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tapin » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:13 pm

quixilver wrote:
Tapin wrote:Hi quixilver, I study guitar in Jakarta Guitar School, how about you? Are you study guitar in Jakarta too?
Do you mean SGJ under David Sylvester?
Yes correct. Do you know Maestro David?

Tapin
Posts: 25
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:07 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tapin » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:14 pm

Tom wrote:Between Bernabe Royal, Imperial and Especial, the sound differernt is sometime insignificant. The only differnt is commercially they use better woods and more decorative on Royal and imperial to make them more expensive than Especial. That does not necessary mean Royal and Imperial sound better than Especial.

All for commercial reason.
Well, the price is double the especial.

Tapin
Posts: 25
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:07 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tapin » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:17 pm

simonm wrote:
Tapin wrote:... it seems P.B Royal is not so popular, maybe the price range is too expensive. Actually I just want an upgrade from my sakurai Pc model.
I did a search for the "sakurai Pc". I found two prices. $7,500 and $9,500. I have no experience of that model but just from a price and reputation perspective you already have a top class instrument. It no doubt has a specific Kohno style sound that may or may not be everybody's taste but it is a taste issue not a "better", "best" issue. When you are willing to spend above that range you have an almost unlimited choice. But unfortunately its like saying I want to spend between $125k and $250k on a car. You could buy a Bentley or a Ferrari: which is better? I have never sat in either so I have no idea (but I would buy a house somewhere instead anyway). Similarly with top end guitars: it is a very personal choice and requires the development of one's own taste.

If you have a clear vision of what type of music you want to play, and where (e.g. home, concert hall), then that might give some people here a hint as to what type of instrument to recommend as it maybe that certain music will work better on one type or another. Some of the people who have chimed in above have lots of experience with some of the best guitars in the world and understand the differences.

It would also be worthwhile to play some good but cheaper instruments to understand the differences. Look at a couple of instruments in the price range $1500 to $3500 and see what the differences are to your own.
[/quote]

thanks for the suggestion, Now I understand the perpectives. Thank you.

Tom
Posts: 1352
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:40 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tom » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:19 pm

Tapin wrote:
Tom wrote:Between Bernabe Royal, Imperial and Especial, the sound differernt is sometime insignificant. The only differnt is commercially they use better woods and more decorative on Royal and imperial to make them more expensive than Especial. That does not necessary mean Royal and Imperial sound better than Especial.

All for commercial reason.
Well, the price is double the especial.
Exactly ... That is why I don't think Royal is a good buy unless you have too much money to burn just for some nice decorative woods. I am someone paying for sound of the guitar and not too much care on the cosmetic. So a guitar like Royal will not appeal to me.

Tapin
Posts: 25
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:07 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tapin » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:22 pm

Tom wrote:
Tapin wrote:
Tom wrote:Between Bernabe Royal, Imperial and Especial, the sound differernt is sometime insignificant. The only differnt is commercially they use better woods and more decorative on Royal and imperial to make them more expensive than Especial. That does not necessary mean Royal and Imperial sound better than Especial.

All for commercial reason.
Well, the price is double the especial.
Exactly ... That is why I don't think Royal is a good buy unless you have too much money to burn just for some nice decorative woods. I am someone paying for sound of the guitar and not too much care on the cosmetic. So a guitar like Royal will not appeal to me.
will you consider buying especial then?

quixilver
Posts: 282
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:22 am
Location: Indonesia / Singapore

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by quixilver » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:26 pm

Tapin wrote:Yes correct. Do you know Maestro David?
Yes, I know him. We often chat and joke around a lot at our Whatsapp group, I met him last few months when I went home to Jakarta.
I can recommend you to meet someone - a friend of mine in Jakarta who can advise you on searching a suitable guitar, I'll continue from here via PM...

Tom
Posts: 1352
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:40 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tom » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:31 pm

Tapin wrote:
Tom wrote: Exactly ... That is why I don't think Royal is a good buy unless you have too much money to burn just for some nice decorative woods. I am someone paying for sound of the guitar and not too much care on the cosmetic. So a guitar like Royal will not appeal to me.
will you consider buying especial then?
Yes, if the price is right. Bernabe does make good guitar and Especial price is at least more reasonable than the other two.

Tapin
Posts: 25
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:07 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by Tapin » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:56 pm

Tom wrote:
Tapin wrote:
Tom wrote: Exactly ... That is why I don't think Royal is a good buy unless you have too much money to burn just for some nice decorative woods. I am someone paying for sound of the guitar and not too much care on the cosmetic. So a guitar like Royal will not appeal to me.
will you consider buying especial then?
Yes, if the price is right. Bernabe does make good guitar and Especial price is at least more reasonable than the other two.
Thanks Tom, I think I will go for the Especial instead of Royal. maybe someday I will save my budget for doubletop guitar or Smallman.

ivan
Posts: 247
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2011 11:28 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by ivan » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:48 pm

Tapin,

i live in Jakarta and i have a lot of experience with high end expensive guitars. I'm helping some Indonesian guitar collector to order high end guitars from Europe - Antonio Marin, Bernd Martin, Bastien Burlot, Paulino Bernabe Especial, etc etc etc ; even some guitars that is almost impossible to acquire such as Dominique Field and Andrea Tacchi. It is my dream to open the eyes of Indonesian people about the beauty of classical guitars.
Please don't be hesitate to contact me, i will be happy to help.
We could discuss together about this matter to make sure you get the "right" guitar.

I will have a new Joshia de Jonge (spruce & CSA rosewood) next month. A new Dominique Field this September. And a new Andrea Tacchi - Coclea Thucea next year.

ivan
Posts: 247
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2011 11:28 am

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by ivan » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:56 pm

Tom wrote:
Tapin wrote:
Tom wrote:Between Bernabe Royal, Imperial and Especial, the sound differernt is sometime insignificant. The only differnt is commercially they use better woods and more decorative on Royal and imperial to make them more expensive than Especial. That does not necessary mean Royal and Imperial sound better than Especial.

All for commercial reason.
Well, the price is double the especial.
Exactly ... That is why I don't think Royal is a good buy unless you have too much money to burn just for some nice decorative woods. I am someone paying for sound of the guitar and not too much care on the cosmetic. So a guitar like Royal will not appeal to me.
Absolutely agree with Tom about this. A lot of excellent guitars cost much less than PB Royal

riffmeister
Posts: 4136
Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 9:15 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA, USA

Re: advice on P.B royal and especial

Post by riffmeister » Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:17 pm

Tapin wrote:I own sakurai PC at the moment
That is a very nice guitar. What's wrong with it?

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