D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

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Colin Bullock
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Colin Bullock » Sun Mar 12, 2017 9:25 pm

Ed Butler wrote:Here is my cut at the Lesson 7 exercises.
PAGANINI GHIRIBIZZO - stumbled here and there, especially on last section - much more practice needed
Ed
watch the timing of the legato begining of 2nd bar, they are too short.
If you try to practice the piece at an even tempo you will soon spot these timing problems.

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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Ed Butler » Mon Mar 13, 2017 12:02 pm

Colin, Andrei - thank you for pointing out specific areas that I can work on. Andrei - I will watch the video today.

Ed

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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Ed Butler » Mon Mar 13, 2017 1:16 pm

Quick question - after watching the video, nails are very important. I do not have nails - yet - starting to grow them today - how much of the twang is created by not having nails?

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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Andrei Puhach » Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:25 pm

Ed Butler wrote:Quick question - after watching the video, nails are very important. I do not have nails - yet - starting to grow them today - how much of the twang is created by not having nails?
Oh, that's interesting, I guess the short nails you already have might produce that. I remember I completely filed down my 'i' finger once and it produced very bad sound.
But it all depends on the right hand position and how fingers move. Good nailless technique might be very different. You might watch "Playing Classical Guitar Without Finger Nails" by Rob MacKillop, but personally I would not recommend this technique unless you have a very good reason.
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Ed Butler » Mon Mar 13, 2017 4:15 pm

Andrei - thanks for all of your help. I plan to grow my nails.

Ed

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Bert Stendahl
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Bert Stendahl » Tue Mar 14, 2017 5:44 pm

"Also, fingers should go into your palm rather than out, so that you kind of push the string into the body of the guitar. This will produce more beautiful sound."

"push the string into the body of the guitar". How is it possible. In your video the fingers moves away from the body.
Andrei Puhach wrote:

Hi Ed, I don't think the sound got any better, sorry. It is still twangy. I guess you might also have the nail shape which does not work well for you.
Here is what I mean saying that fingers should go into the palm:


Also, please watch "Learning with Legends - William Kanengiser", it has great explanation about how the RH fingers should move, about nails and how to produce good sound.
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Bert Stendahl
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Bert Stendahl » Tue Mar 14, 2017 5:45 pm

Acciaccatura - Ghiribizzo

Is this correct (measure 11, acciaccatura). Playing string 1 with i. Pull-off a string 1 (no pick) and at the same time play string 2 with P?
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Andrei Puhach » Tue Mar 14, 2017 9:38 pm

Bert Stendahl wrote:"Also, fingers should go into your palm rather than out, so that you kind of push the string into the body of the guitar. This will produce more beautiful sound."

"push the string into the body of the guitar". How is it possible. In your video the fingers moves away from the body.
Andrei Puhach wrote:

Hi Ed, I don't think the sound got any better, sorry. It is still twangy. I guess you might also have the nail shape which does not work well for you.
Here is what I mean saying that fingers should go into the palm:


Also, please watch "Learning with Legends - William Kanengiser", it has great explanation about how the RH fingers should move, about nails and how to produce good sound.
Well, technically you are right, it is impossible to do that in its pure form in free stroke. The point is one should strive NOT to pinch strings.
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Colin Bullock » Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:33 pm

Bert Stendahl wrote:Acciaccatura - Ghiribizzo

Is this correct (measure 11, acciaccatura). Playing string 1 with i. Pull-off a string 1 (no pick) and at the same time play string 2 with P?
I think in theory you are right because the acciaccatura links only to the upper note. However, because it has to be played very fast I dont think it is practical to do it that way. I found this which suggests playing 1st note & bass note together.
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Z8L ... te&f=false

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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Andrei Puhach » Fri Mar 17, 2017 10:50 pm

Colin Bullock wrote:
Bert Stendahl wrote:Acciaccatura - Ghiribizzo

Is this correct (measure 11, acciaccatura). Playing string 1 with i. Pull-off a string 1 (no pick) and at the same time play string 2 with P?
I think in theory you are right because the acciaccatura links only to the upper note. However, because it has to be played very fast I dont think it is practical to do it that way. I found this which suggests playing 1st note & bass note together.
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Z8L ... te&f=false
Right, the bass and the _first_ note should be played together.
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Bert Stendahl
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Bert Stendahl » Sun Mar 19, 2017 5:55 pm

Now it is easier. :idea: :idea: :idea:
Colin Bullock wrote:
I think in theory you are right because the acciaccatura links only to the upper note. However, because it has to be played very fast I dont think it is practical to do it that way. I found this which suggests playing 1st note & bass note together.
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Z8L ... te&f=false
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by DaveMoutrie » Tue Mar 21, 2017 5:17 am

Andrei Puhach wrote:
Ed Butler wrote:Andrei - is this sort of what you mean - minus the exaggeration, slowness, missed notes, etc?


Youtube
Hi Ed, hope you don't mind me adding my two penneth after my long absence from the forum.

I can see from the video that you are pulling your hand up and away from the guitar and the twanging sound is made by the string hitting the frets. Could this be because your nail is getting hooked up on the string and you have to pull away to release it?
When you look at your nail from sideways on is there a slight hook shape to it?

One thing you could experiment with is stiking the string at different angles. For example, if you strike the string at 45% rather than square on at 90% you are less likely to get it hooked up on the string.

There is a lot of advice around on nail shape and Pumping Nylon goes into great detail about it. I did briefly try the ramp shape, but it didn't work for me so went back to the original advice that the nail shape should follow the contours of the fingers - first shaping with an emery board and then finishing off with a fine oil stone or fine grade wet and dry.

Good luck Ed, and keep on keeping on. :wink:
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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Ed Butler » Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:50 am

Andrei - thank you for taking the time to write this advice. I have just started growing the nails a week ago so they have not come too far. I do have the pumping nylon book, along with some others that I will use to shape the nails as they grow. The pulling away of the hand is a bad habit that I am trying to break by adding specific exercises to my practice routine. I will also try to change my angle of strike as you suggest.

Thank again.

Ed Butler

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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Ed Butler » Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:41 pm

I meant to say - thanks David - very good advice that I will focus on in the coming weeks.

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Re: D03 Classical guitar lesson 07

Post by Chu Bun » Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:44 pm

Sorry for being late in the discussions. I was on Spring break then caught a flu afterward.
I agree with Dave. If you pull the string up and release it, the first and maximum swing will be in the downward direction and if the action of your guitar is too high, the string may hit the fret and make a twanging sound. Instead you should push the string down with your finger, then let the string slips up to make the sound. This is very similar to when you do a rest stroke. I remember reading somewhere your rest stroke and free stroke should be almost identical until the very last phase where the finger rests.
By the way, I don't think you really need to grow nails to play classical guitar. I guess most of us started too late to worry about reaching world class level, so a few disadvantages will probably not make much difference. I play without nails and I would say the only time I regress not growing nail is when I tried to learn the piece Recuerdos de la Alhambra. So I learn to hate that piece instead!

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