Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Discussion of all aspects of early instruments, lutes, theorbos, vihuelas, Renaissance guitars and Baroque guitars.
Duy Bowyer
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Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Duy Bowyer » Wed May 03, 2017 11:58 pm

I have been reading on early romantic period guitars and I have become obsessed with the notion of the baroque sound, the baroque and renaissance music and also the connections to the early period of classical guitar music. I have decided to look for an early romantic guitar and have been looking all over the net with limited success.
I prefer a baroque shaped guitar but I also want a 6 stringed guitar (tuned to the current classical guitars). I know this is twisting the tradition, but my objective is to get the look, feel and sound of the early era while being able to play suitable classical pieces on them.
I came across the Giorgio Sellas Baroque Guitar (6 string replica) by Early Music Direct - http://www.earlymusicdirect.com/guitars ... uitar.html
The guitar has Canadian Spruce sound board, back with mahogany and maple with fillets of ebony. The workmanship on the rosette is very intricate and it looks like a well made instrument, not just an entry level one.
I would be grateful for any comments or feedback on this particular guitar, or generally on baroque style guitars like this. If you have played one or have one for sale, I would be very interested in.
BTW, I have also taken a liking to the Italian Fabricatore guitar, but these are so rare to find.
Regards,
Duy Bowyer
Jose Maria Vilaplana NT (2017) Spruce.
Cachimba C7 (1985) Cedar.
Takamine GC5 (2011) Spruce.

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spanishguitarmusic
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by spanishguitarmusic » Thu May 04, 2017 12:51 am

I checked out the link and the guitar featured really looks very nice! I also listened to the video on there and it sounded so good as well! Thanks for providing the link as I also like early style music!

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Stephen Kenyon
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Stephen Kenyon » Thu May 04, 2017 5:47 pm

As well as the construction the signature part of the sound of the baroque guitar is the double stringing. There was a period when 6 double strings were used (in the modern tuning) before single stringing won over. I watched (some of!) that video and from its tone would suggest you might be better just getting a copy of an early romantic guitar, rather than this strange hybrid, not least I'm not sure it would have much resale value. Obviously though it wouldn't have the visual connection.
Its also worth pointing that you might be advised to at least try out a guitar of this general kind of shape and size (if you haven't already). It took me quite a while to get used to simply holding my Batov (see below) and it might be rather a shock, and an expensive one, if you find you don't get on with it.
My guess is the main application for the guitar you linked to is in theatrical productions, much in the way 'guitar-lutes' can be found in Shakespeare productions.
Simon Ambridge Series 40 (2005)
Trevor Semple Series 88 (1992)
Louis Panormo (1838)
Alexander Batov Baroque Guitar (2013)

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Isabelle Frizac
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Isabelle Frizac » Thu May 04, 2017 6:11 pm

6 strings ? hum... :?

It 's a guitar for "tourists of the guitar" (sucker) not a copy of an original. :x

"We have modified it to feature six single strings to allow access to the wider guitar repertoire. The back is made of alternate ribs of mahogany and maple with fillets of ebony."(price: £ 1,199.00 )

The 5 course Baroque style guitar is a historic reproduction based on the instruments made by Giorgio Sellas. The original, made in 1627, made be seen at the Ashmolean Museum in Oxford.( Country of Origin: Pakistan. Price: $735.20 ).

The authentic guitar by Giorgio Sellas, from the Ashmolean Museum in Oxford:

guitare baroque Sellas.jpg
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Last edited by Isabelle Frizac on Thu May 04, 2017 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
keep hope !
Bastien Burlot 2014" special anniversary" n°1, Pappalardo 1982, Antonio Ruiz Lopez 1974, and other instruments ...;-)

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RobMacKillop
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by RobMacKillop » Thu May 04, 2017 6:25 pm

Hideous.

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Isabelle Frizac
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Isabelle Frizac » Thu May 04, 2017 6:35 pm

I prefer my baroque guitar! :ouioui:
Modern copy ...Gwendal LeCorre ( France, 2009)
guitare baroque Le Corre.jpg
guitare baroque Le Corre2.jpg
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keep hope !
Bastien Burlot 2014" special anniversary" n°1, Pappalardo 1982, Antonio Ruiz Lopez 1974, and other instruments ...;-)

Catire
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Catire » Thu May 04, 2017 7:19 pm

I suspect that the guitar in the link you provided will fail to give you the sound of a baroque guitar. What you are hearing in the clip is a romantic guitar, just not a very good one. You will just have to fish, or cut bait. If you want a baroque guitar sound, you will just have buy a good modern copy, and learn how to play it. It's not just the guitar. There's the technique, as well. And, yes, it will take you some time.
"The true mystery of the world is the visible, not the invisible." - Oscar Wilde

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Luuttuaja
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Luuttuaja » Thu May 04, 2017 9:56 pm

I honestly think this "modified baroque guitar" isn't a very good option. For me, it sounds like a poor early romantic guitar. I would rather comission a real Sor-era guitar replica. I agree baroque guitars are stunningly beautiful, and if you are interested in playing Sanz, Corbetta, de Murcia etc. then you would really need a genuine baroque guitar. I guess there are luthiers that do double-strung early romantic guitars, but those would not have the visual looks of a baroque one.

Duy Bowyer
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Duy Bowyer » Fri May 05, 2017 12:15 am

I am a novice in this era of early romantic guitars. I am drawn to the look and sound of an early period guitar, especially the baroque style. I know the "hybrid" 6 string reproduction of a Giorgio Sellas is in many ways untraditional and unrepresentative of the era that I wanted to experience. Apart from respect for tradition, your comments have made me thinking more about the originality of the instruments and the sound.
It's not my intention to "twist" the tradition and play baroque music on a 6 string baroque imitation. My real reason is that I have never seen, let alone play, a baroque 5 course guitar. These instruments are rare in Australia. I do not know how different and difficult it is to learn and play the 5 course guitar. 6 course baroque guitars are even harder to find.
Hi Isabelle, love your Gwendal LeCorre guitar. I wish I could learn to play.
Regards,
Duy Bowyer
Jose Maria Vilaplana NT (2017) Spruce.
Cachimba C7 (1985) Cedar.
Takamine GC5 (2011) Spruce.

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Luuttuaja
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Luuttuaja » Fri May 05, 2017 12:15 pm

One thing to consider is the different tunings for baroque guitar. I could imagine the re-entrant tunings being a bit troublesome at first. In that way, it might be easier to start with the standard 6 course tuning and modern arrangements of baroque guitar pieces.

Perhaps still it would be best to find somebody with an actual baroque guitar and try it a bit? You should have somebody who knows how to play it and knows how the instrument differs from a modern guitar.

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Isabelle Frizac
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Isabelle Frizac » Fri May 05, 2017 12:54 pm

This could help you a little ...

here
You can request information from these luthiers for the baroque guitar.

:bye:

Thanks for the compliment for my guitar!
She's very happy ... :chitarrista:

And my romantic guitar ( Maurice Dupont, France, 2008)
guitare romantique 02.JPG
guitare romantique 07.JPG
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Last edited by Isabelle Frizac on Fri May 05, 2017 6:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
keep hope !
Bastien Burlot 2014" special anniversary" n°1, Pappalardo 1982, Antonio Ruiz Lopez 1974, and other instruments ...;-)

Duy Bowyer
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Duy Bowyer » Fri May 05, 2017 1:29 pm

I definitely need to keep looking and trying to find a luthier or someone with a baroque guitar who can show me and explain to me more about the instrument and how it is played. Thank you for your comments and information. It helps me a great deal as I am exploring and learning more and more about the instrument and the sense of history and tradition associated with the period.
Regards,
Duy Bowyer
Jose Maria Vilaplana NT (2017) Spruce.
Cachimba C7 (1985) Cedar.
Takamine GC5 (2011) Spruce.

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Isabelle Frizac
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Isabelle Frizac » Fri May 05, 2017 1:35 pm

Others adress:

Early Music Society of Victoria Inc.
9 Merribell Avenue
East Coburg
Victoria 3058
Australia
Phone (03) 755 2137

. . .

Australian Association of Musical Instrument Makers
PO Box 341
Epping
NSW 2121
Australia,
Phone (02) 772 4415
Fax (02) 868 2893

. . .



Early Music Association of New South Wales (Australia):
The EMA of NSW is an active organisation which publishes a newsletter
monthly, has monthly meetings which involve speakers, players, both
professional and amateur and consort play-ins.
The contact address is-
Early Music Association of NSW Inc.
PO Box 735
Chatswood
NSW 2057
Australia
Our voice phone number is
(02) 550 1301
and you may also drop us some e-mail if you wish
Thanks for your time
Hilary Rhodes
hilary@geko.com.au


and here :D

:bye:
keep hope !
Bastien Burlot 2014" special anniversary" n°1, Pappalardo 1982, Antonio Ruiz Lopez 1974, and other instruments ...;-)

Duy Bowyer
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Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:20 am
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by Duy Bowyer » Fri May 05, 2017 11:58 pm

Thanks for the info Isabelle!
Regards,
Duy Bowyer
Jose Maria Vilaplana NT (2017) Spruce.
Cachimba C7 (1985) Cedar.
Takamine GC5 (2011) Spruce.

powderedtoastman
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Re: Baroque guitar (6 string) and Early Romantic guitars

Post by powderedtoastman » Sat May 06, 2017 4:27 am

Justin C White in Australia makes a very affordable early romantic guitar... do a google search and I'm very sure you will find his website quickly.
I contemplated asking him to build me one as a backup to the more serious one that is in my future, but I lucked out and found a bargain on something else immediately available at the time, so I didn't get in touch with Justin. So I can't directly vouch for the playability and quality of his instruments, but there are videos on Youtube of a player playing his romantic and terz guitars, and they do sound pretty good to me!

Edit-- I just looked at his webpage and he makes a Renaissance guitar too. So he may really be of interest to you!

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