Renaissance Lute

Discussion of all aspects of early instruments, lutes, theorbos, vihuelas, Renaissance guitars and Baroque guitars.
Moderndandy

Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Moderndandy » Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:22 am

Michael.N. wrote:Yes, I don't see the point of removing those courses. Anyway, it seems you have your money's worth in the strings and Pegs alone!
What do you mean strings?

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Valéry Sauvage
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Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Valéry Sauvage » Mon Jun 10, 2013 12:21 pm

Yes knots should be on top (when you're holding the lute, so bass side) All on the same side.
Count Basie: I don't worry about virtuosity. I do what I like to do. If I'm a virtuoso, that's great. If not, I'm doing what I like to do.

Moderndandy

Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Moderndandy » Mon Jun 10, 2013 3:19 pm

Valery,
I've enjoyed your YouTube posts of Dowland pieces. Thanks
Richard

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Valéry Sauvage
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Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Valéry Sauvage » Tue Jun 11, 2013 12:04 pm

Thanks, enjoy playing the lute ;-) (and put back the bass courses, with Dowland you will need... :lol: )
Count Basie: I don't worry about virtuosity. I do what I like to do. If I'm a virtuoso, that's great. If not, I'm doing what I like to do.

Moderndandy

Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Moderndandy » Thu Jun 13, 2013 11:00 pm

Yes of course!!
May I ask, which courses if any do you use octaves? When it arrived it was strung with octaves for the 6,7 and 8 course. 1 - 5 were in unison.

Scot Tremblay
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Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Scot Tremblay » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:37 am

Moderndandy wrote:Yes of course!!
May I ask, which courses if any do you use octaves? When it arrived it was strung with octaves for the 6,7 and 8 course. 1 - 5 were in unison.
I use the octaves from 5 - 8. I tried unisons on 5 for a while. I was having a technical issue getting the two strings of the 5th course to sound simultaneously when playing that course with a finger rather than the thumb. But I didn't like the muddy tone of the unison bass on the 5th so I switched it back and upgraded my technique.
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"One picture is worth a thousand words. So, for me, one good note put where it should be put, will say what it will take some people many notes to say. ~B.B. King, 1986

Moderndandy

Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Moderndandy » Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:05 pm

I would think playing the 5th course with a finger would probably be Index on a run.

Scot do you play Renaissance or Baroque or both?

Scot Tremblay
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Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Scot Tremblay » Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:05 pm

Moderndandy wrote:I would think playing the 5th course with a finger would probably be Index on a run.

Scot do you play Renaissance or Baroque or both?

For me palying the 5th course with fingers was/is kind of a hold over from my classical guitar technique. The trick with the double courses, to get the strings to sound at the same time where one doesn't overpower the other, is strike the course in the middle, the space between the strings as it were. It took a little work on the 5th course but I got it and decided that on my favorite lute the octaves on the 5th sounds best. Some players whose lutes have more than 8 courses use the unison 5th...it seems the more courses the lower the unison tuning goes. But as with all things lute, this is open for debate...

I only play renaissance lutes not any in D minor tuning. This takes me right through the Italian Baroque repertoire (my personal favorite). The Italians never really adopted the D minor tuning, they just added more courses to their lutes. I find the music in D minor tuning (with the exception of Weiss) not to my liking. To my ear, most of it is droll and cumbersome...there I've said it in public...let the flames begin! :chaud:

Weiss, on the other hand, is the one Baroque lute composer who could easily convince me to get a Baroque lute but to date I have been too occupied with the 10 lifetimes of music available for renaissance tuning....we'll see.
Scot Tremblay Guitars

"One picture is worth a thousand words. So, for me, one good note put where it should be put, will say what it will take some people many notes to say. ~B.B. King, 1986

simonm
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Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by simonm » Sat Jun 15, 2013 5:28 pm

I did a 10 course renaissance type lute about 25-30 years ago in anegre. This is the rosette. Haven't tuned it up for years.
rosette.jpg
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Karl Markis

Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Karl Markis » Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:02 pm

Are metal frets on a lute a deal breaker?

I am interested in learning Renaissance Lute, specifically for John Dowland’s repertoire, and am on a hunt to find a reasonably priced, luthier made instrument. I am currently learning piano and electric guitar, and have no experience in classical guitar. I spent months deciding whether it was wise to pursue classical guitar, ultimately deciding I cannot have nails of any length because of my piano playing, which took classical guitar out of the picture.

RWHowe is selling a seven course lute by Manouk Papazian for $1250, which to my knowledge is the only lute for sale on Delcamp (link: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=79477). Papazian built around 40 Renaissance Lutes, so he had some experience with them. However, the lute has metal frets and Brazilian Rosewood ribs, so it appears to be influenced by the classical guitar, like Julian Bream’s lute. Would it be wise to learn Renaissance Lute with this instrument? I have read that lutes use movable frets for exploring musical temperament and tunings, but how much repertoire would be lost if one were to play a fixed, metal fret lute? Is there a percentage of repertoire that requires movable frets?

The reason I am interested in RWHowe’s lute is that the majority of lutes and their luthiers are exorbitantly expensive and mostly made/available in Europe, primarily the UK. If I could acquire an authentic, luthier-made Renaissance Lute for under $1500, I wouldn’t think twice to purchase it.

Moderndandy

Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Moderndandy » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:56 am

You should check out the Lutes for Sale or wanted page on the Lute Society of England's website.

I was just able to purchase an 8 course lute for $2000 made by a luthier in Bulgaria. It was sold second hand of course.

As for the dilemma of getting the Lute with the gut frets or the Bream style guitar lute with wire. I say go with the real thing. It's not that much more deal with.

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Michael.N.
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Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Michael.N. » Thu Sep 19, 2013 11:40 am

I want one of these:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uApiRD7GB8

You can't see it on that video but it has a loooonnnnggg Neck, which puts me off a bit but I love the sound. Bach, Weiss doesn't sound much better IMO. I suppose the next one down is a swann Neck, then a 13 course with the rider, then an 11 course and maybe a more sensible 10 course tuned in the minor. A lot of strings to deal with but because of the low tension the strings last forever. I had a few strings on my Baroque Guitar that I changed after 3 years! and even then it wasn't really necessary to change them. Cheap running costs.
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Scot Tremblay
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Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Scot Tremblay » Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:32 pm

Andreas v. Holst makes a really nice one of those. Shorter string length (65/110 cm), can be double strung or single. If you want to hear it Sylvan Bergeron and David Tayler both play one and have posted many youtube videos...That's the one I've been eye balling....

http://www.lautenvonholst.de/fotos3-en.html
Scot Tremblay Guitars

"One picture is worth a thousand words. So, for me, one good note put where it should be put, will say what it will take some people many notes to say. ~B.B. King, 1986

Moderndandy

Re: Renaissance Lute

Post by Moderndandy » Sat Feb 15, 2014 2:26 am

I thought the instrument in the video didn't really sound like a lute and when I looked a bit closer, it looks like it's just single courses not double.


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