Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

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Rognvald
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Rognvald » Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:32 pm

soltirefa wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:42 pm
I switched off after a few seconds. No idea how it comes across to anyone else but it sounded terribly processed, the mixer controls must have been set at max! Sorry but I just can't take it seriously. I just know I'm not hearing what the guitarist is hearing, not even close.
this piece IMHO May not be best represented on this instrument. Or maybe the instrument is not well suited for this piece. If you have to add that many strings (which I think detracts from the sonority of the guitar) find a quartet.
also found the performance somewhat less than satisfying though I persevered to the end. Disregarding interpretation, quality of sound etc., just the many hiatus moments (whilst preparing a new right hand position?) killed it for me.
Translation: It sounds like crap.
Solti,
Do you always let others speak for you? Group consensus only tells you what the group thinks . . . it is not an indication of anything else. However, to be more specific, I think the guitarist played the piece cleanly with sensitivity to the melodic line and the Harp Guitar added an interesting harmonic depth to the piece that a 6 string CG cannot achieve. The audio has nothing to do with how he played but only how the recording sounded. I own some scratchy LP's of Wagner's Ring Cycle that I wouldn't sell for my life and the audio does not in the least diminish his performance. Brin Addison is clearly a proficient player and for you to label this piece as "crap' means that you can play this music in a vastly superior way to the performance provided which is why I asked you to give us your version or something in a similar vein. I would like to add one further comment: I have been a performing musician for most of my life as both a vocation and avocation and have had the good fortune to know and play with some outstanding musicians. It has been my experience that I never met a great musician that used terms like "crap" to describe a player with lesser talents who was clearly serious about his music. It is not only mean-spirited but shows a lack of sensitivity not common among serious musicians. . . and NO, I do not consider most Rockers or CW players serious musicians. Playing again . . . Rognvald
"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music." Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spake Zarathustra

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Contreras
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Contreras » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:24 pm

Rognvald wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:32 pm
for you to label this piece as "crap' means that you can play this music in a vastly superior way to the performance provided
Sorry, this does not 'mean' that ... Logically fallacious is the term I was searching for :mrgreen:
Last edited by Contreras on Mon Nov 06, 2017 2:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Jeffrey Armbruster » Sun Nov 05, 2017 11:47 pm

My dislike of the piece had nothing to do with the quality of the playing. I never mentioned that. Great actors often appear in film or on stage in a misconceived production. Happens all the time. That doesn't save the lousy film or play. Same thing here.
Look I didn't stick around the piece long enough to analyze it thoroughly; I have other things to do. It sounded awful. It just didn't work--for me.
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Big bird
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Big bird » Mon Nov 06, 2017 12:33 am

Rognvald wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:01 pm
"Are you suggesting that rock and country players cannot be "well educated" or "practiced musicians"? Surely not?" Mark Clifton-Gautier


Oh, God, Mark,
Your remarks are the classic example of what philosophy calls a "Red Herring." If you don't know what that means here's the definition:
"Description: Attempting to redirect the argument to another issue to which the person doing the redirecting can better respond. While it is similar to the avoiding the issue fallacy, the red herring is a deliberate diversion of attention with the intention of trying to abandon the original argument." Logically Fallacious
You must be a hoot at parties.....
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Mark Clifton-Gaultier
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Mark Clifton-Gaultier » Mon Nov 06, 2017 1:35 am

Rognvald wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:01 pm
Oh, God, Mark,
Your remarks are the classic example of what philosophy calls a "Red Herring." If you don't know what that means here's the definition:
"Description: Attempting to redirect the argument to another issue to which the person doing the redirecting can better respond. While it is similar to the avoiding the issue fallacy, the red herring is a deliberate diversion of attention with the intention of trying to abandon the original argument." Logically Fallacious
I'm an atheist Rognvald but, in any case, you're quite, quite mistaken.

1. I responded perfectly adequately to your request for comment i.e.
Mark wrote:I also found the performance somewhat less than satisfying though I persevered to the end. Disregarding interpretation, quality of sound etc., just the many hiatus moments (whilst preparing a new right hand position?) killed it for me.
I did not find the performance terrible but not "wonderful" either.

2. I drew attention to the similarity between your own lack of corroborative elaboration and that of the respondents you attempted to deride. Terms of praise are just as subjective as those of denigration.

3. The question of elitism pertaining to classical versus other genres (introduced by yourself) is neither straw man nor red herring but entirely separate; many on this forum are well educated practised musicians capable of sustaining more than one idea in a single thread. I understand that some of them can even manage the occasional country guitar lick.

Nonetheless I thank you for your endeavour on my behalf, though I might humbly suggest that if you think this ...
Rognvald wrote:... for you to label this piece as "crap' means that you can play this music in a vastly superior way to the performance provided...
... is in any way logical then your own grasp of both philosophy and linguistics leaves something to be desired.
Rognvald wrote:... our standards of education in the USA have fallen so precipitously in the last thirty years.
Not much data to judge by but I have a niggling suspicion that you might, just possibly, be mistaken.

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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by soltirefa » Mon Nov 06, 2017 1:45 am

You must be a hoot at parties.....
I had the same thought.

Rognvald
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Rognvald » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:22 pm

Rognvald wrote:
... our standards of education in the USA have fallen so precipitously in the last thirty years.

Mark Clifon-Gautier wrote:
"Not much data to judge by but I have a niggling suspicion that you might, just possibly, be mistaken."

Mark, your above statement is so patently absurd since there are hundreds of articles/studies that corroborate my statement on declining education in the USA. Just Google the subject and you will find the sad results in the NY Times, New Yorker Magazine, The Washington Post and US News under the topic: "decline in education test scores 2016." Finally, as a final remark and back to the topic of discussion, I believe educated people have a responsibility to speak civilly and avoid using terms like "crap" in describing music and a performer without any logical explanation since this would move the debate from a serious discussion to the level of language used by Beavis and Butthead while watching M-TV. There's an old folk saying: water seeks its own level. This certainly applies in this case. Playing again . . . Rognvald
"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music." Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spake Zarathustra

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Mark Clifton-Gaultier
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Mark Clifton-Gaultier » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:55 pm

Rognvald wrote:
Rognvald wrote:... our standards of education in the USA have fallen so precipitously in the last thirty years.
Mark Clifon-Gautier wrote:Not much data to judge by but I have a niggling suspicion that you might, just possibly, be mistaken.
Mark, your above statement is so patently absurd that I will provide one example of hundreds of studies that corroborate my statement on declining education in the USA. Here's one by the Washington Post in December 2016: https://www.washingtonpost.com/.../educ ... e6-a677-b6... If you choose to look further, you will find NO contrary evidence to suggest otherwise.
My apologies Rognvald - I should have qualified my comment for the less astute amongst us. I assumed that the inference that I was appraising only the data available in this thread was clear.
Rognvald wrote:I believe educated people have a responsibility to speak civilly
I believe in evaluating a person by their actions.

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Contreras
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Contreras » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:58 pm

Rognvald wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:32 pm
. . . and NO, I do not consider most Rockers or CW players serious musicians. Playing again . . . Rognvald
Oh dear ... Mind wide closed
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by simonm » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:17 pm

I quite liked the sound of it. I have a soft spot for schrammel guitars. :-) For comparison I listened to the same part on piano version. It is unlikely to become my favorite tune either on guitar or piano.

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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Jeffrey Armbruster » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:33 pm

"I believe educated people have a responsibility to speak civilly and avoid using terms like "crap" in describing music and a performer"

Rognvald, you insult people right and left on this thread just because they have a different take on a performance than you do. Are your ears really too pure to hear the sound of the word 'crap' without your falling over? Careful, you'll hear worse at any Arthur Miller play, or In Ben Johnson for that matter. I believe your objection is a bit of a red herring.
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Rognvald
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Rognvald » Tue Nov 07, 2017 12:03 am

Jeffrey Armbruster wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:33 pm
"I believe educated people have a responsibility to speak civilly and avoid using terms like "crap" in describing music and a performer"

Rognvald, you insult people right and left on this thread just because they have a different take on a performance than you do. Are your ears really too pure to hear the sound of the word 'crap' without your falling over? Careful, you'll hear worse at any Arthur Miller play, or In Ben Johnson for that matter. I believe your objection is a bit of a red herring.

Hi, Jeff,
I have an admission to make to this Forum. Actually, I am a reincarnation of a 17th Century American Quaker. Therefore, my tolerance for licentious terms as "crap" or any other scatological reference rubs a severe nerve in my neurological system. The testament is that I made a living, for many years, as an R and B and Jazz Saxophonist. And, for a man of your worldly acumen, you must surely know the pristine and ethereal life I have lived. Please excuse me since I am in Therapy, as we speak, and hope, one day soon, that I will join the Herd in their elevated position as purveyors of normalcy, common sense and a touch of the profane in all matter large and small. In religious confession and playing again . . .Rognvald. . . Ave Verum Corpus . . . . . . .
"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music." Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spake Zarathustra

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Contreras
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by Contreras » Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:25 am

😂😂😂
I guess that's all we need to know
Keep on taking the tablets.
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slidika
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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by slidika » Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:41 pm

Yeah, some music does not seem to lend itself to another instrument very well. I heard Bela Fleck play Moonlight Sonata (1st movement) on his banjo -- I really did not like it (and I played bluegrass banjo then). I am not a big fan of electric guitars due to overuse of effects, but I have watched Tina S play the 3rd movement of Moonlight Sonata on an electric several times, just to watch her playing ability. For those who don't know me, I was a piano major way back in my college days and played the 1st movement on the piano. Maybe I'm a little biased, but I think the 1st movement, at least, sounds best on a grand piano.
Whenever I am not ready for my music lesson, I call it 'facing the music'.

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Re: Moonlight Sonata: Harp Guitar

Post by MumpyLama » Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:11 pm

That is a first for me, I never knew that a harp guitar even existed. It does sound very beautiful but I thought it would have more of a "harp" sound with trills? etc. It must be quite a bit more complicated to learn and play, at least it looks larger and more difficult. I'm still a newbie to guitar so everything seems challenging. Thanks for drawing our attention to such a different instrument, there are probably quite a few variations that I don't know about.
-MumpyLama

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