Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

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nmshu1
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Location: Los Angeles, California, USA

Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:14 am

Anyone has experience in guitar adjustment such as change of nut materials , saddle materials, nut strings spacing, saddle strings spacing, strings action, 12 / 6 holes tie......
Otto Vowinkel 650, Cedar/BRW; Córdoba C9 650 A&B, Cedar/MH;
Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/IRW; Sweet Tone 640, Spruce/Lam. RW;
German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/MP; German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/PE;
Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top/MP

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petermc61
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Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by petermc61 » Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:22 am

Sure, changed saddles, shaved nuts. Had a luthier custom make a individual (string by string) compensated nut plus saddle set.

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James Lister
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Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by James Lister » Tue Jun 06, 2017 7:25 am

nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:14 am
Anyone has experience in guitar adjustment such as change of nut materials , saddle materials, nut strings spacing, saddle strings spacing, strings action, 12 / 6 holes tie......
I think you need to refine your question and be more specific. I suspect the majority of forum members have experience of at least one of those, and a great many have experience of all of them.

James
James Lister, luthier, Sheffield UK

Guitar Maniac
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Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by Guitar Maniac » Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:35 am

About 4 years ago I brought my Manuel Rodriguez e Hijos C1 Matte to a local luthier and asked him to help me add an extra 20th fret just for the famous high C note in "Sueno en la floresta", he did it pretty well for a fee of about more than 20$, later I had to brought the same guitar to him one more time to fix the fretboard curvature caused by tropical weather, this time it cost about 37$.

My guitar has been in good condition ever since then, however I'm still struggling with insane technique demand of that piece.

nmshu1
Posts: 278
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 12:16 am
Location: Los Angeles, California, USA

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Jun 06, 2017 11:56 am

Guitar Maniac wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:35 am
About 4 years ago I brought my Manuel Rodriguez e Hijos C1 Matte to a local luthier and asked him to help me add an extra 20th fret just for the famous high C note in "Sueno en la floresta", he did it pretty well for a fee of about more than 20$, later I had to brought the same guitar to him one more time to fix the fretboard curvature caused by tropical weather, this time it cost about 37$.

My guitar has been in good condition ever since then, however I'm still struggling with insane technique demand of that piece.
To play Forest Dream, you have to check more : action, spacing at nut and saddle, strings scale, guitar itself...without the 20th fret, you still can play it (omit some).
Otto Vowinkel 650, Cedar/BRW; Córdoba C9 650 A&B, Cedar/MH;
Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/IRW; Sweet Tone 640, Spruce/Lam. RW;
German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/MP; German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/PE;
Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top/MP

Guitar Maniac
Posts: 45
Joined: Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:19 pm

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by Guitar Maniac » Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:42 pm

nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 11:56 am
Guitar Maniac wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:35 am
About 4 years ago I brought my Manuel Rodriguez e Hijos C1 Matte to a local luthier and asked him to help me add an extra 20th fret just for the famous high C note in "Sueno en la floresta", he did it pretty well for a fee of about more than 20$, later I had to brought the same guitar to him one more time to fix the fretboard curvature caused by tropical weather, this time it cost about 37$.

My guitar has been in good condition ever since then, however I'm still struggling with insane technique demand of that piece.
To play Forest Dream, you have to check more : action, spacing at nut and saddle, strings scale, guitar itself...without the 20th fret, you still can play it (omit some).
My guitar scale length is standard 650 mm but the neck width is a bit wider than normal - a bit greater than 53 mm, the action is pretty good. I have small hands with very short fingers, at full stretch, the distance from my thumb to my little finger is only 22 cm, and on a piano I can only reach a full octave, still not really comfortable.

However for the 1st tremolo section of Floresta, I don't try to keep the bass note ringing at all by stretching full 7 frets, instead I use hinge barre for the previous bar and then move my left index finger towards the end of the fretboard to be easier for my little finger to reach the high note past 12th fret, for the stretch of the 3rd tremolo section (after the cadenza) I would like to use the similar fingering as John Williams did in his rendition in 1977 concert, or similar to Aimée Piché's one

What really holds me back is the awkward thumb movements in the 1st tremolo section, especially when the thumb has to move from 6th or 5th string immediately to 2nd string, it makes the right hand unsteady so it's much more difficult to have a smooth tremolo :(

Btw, sorry for my off-topic reply :(

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georgemarousi
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Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by georgemarousi » Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:50 pm

Just to highly advice everyone to go to a luthier for a proper nut - saddle setup!

Difficult pieces like the above ( which I fight with too by the way ) are processes where a very good setup is a must! :)


edit: this piece was the reason to retry to better solve me hooked nails issue ( have already had done guitar's setups done OK ). At difficult levels you need all your weapons armed !
--Classicals--
Paulino Bernabe Especial 2009
Ramirez 1A 1980
Alhambra Luthier india 2012
Juan Martinez nr 55 (the return @2014)
Yamaha cg 110 (as a kid @88)
--
student again since 2015, to my degree @..? - God bless!

nmshu1
Posts: 278
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 12:16 am
Location: Los Angeles, California, USA

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Jun 06, 2017 6:05 pm

Guitar Maniac wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:42 pm
nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 11:56 am
Guitar Maniac wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:35 am
About 4 years ago I brought my Manuel Rodriguez e Hijos C1 Matte to a local luthier and asked him to help me add an extra 20th fret just for the famous high C note in "Sueno en la floresta", he did it pretty well for a fee of about more than 20$, later I had to brought the same guitar to him one more time to fix the fretboard curvature caused by tropical weather, this time it cost about 37$.

My guitar has been in good condition ever since then, however I'm still struggling with insane technique demand of that piece.
To play Forest Dream, you have to check more : action, spacing at nut and saddle, strings scale, guitar itself...without the 20th fret, you still can play it (omit some).
My guitar scale length is standard 650 mm but the neck width is a bit wider than normal - a bit greater than 53 mm, the action is pretty good. I have small hands with very short fingers, at full stretch, the distance from my thumb to my little finger is only 22 cm, and on a piano I can only reach a full octave, still not really comfortable.

However for the 1st tremolo section of Floresta, I don't try to keep the bass note ringing at all by stretching full 7 frets, instead I use hinge barre for the previous bar and then move my left index finger towards the end of the fretboard to be easier for my little finger to reach the high note past 12th fret, for the stretch of the 3rd tremolo section (after the cadenza) I would like to use the similar fingering as John Williams did in his rendition in 1977 concert, or similar to Aimée Piché's one

What really holds me back is the awkward thumb movements in the 1st tremolo section, especially when the thumb has to move from 6th or 5th string immediately to 2nd string, it makes the right hand unsteady so it's much more difficult to have a smooth tremolo :(

Btw, sorry for my off-topic reply :(
Maybe you can have additional nut and saddle with narrower strings spacing which I mean adjustment... 22 cm is big enough for 650 I think... My hand is 18.5 - 19 cm only...so I have 630,635... guitars...
Otto Vowinkel 650, Cedar/BRW; Córdoba C9 650 A&B, Cedar/MH;
Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/IRW; Sweet Tone 640, Spruce/Lam. RW;
German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/MP; German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/PE;
Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top/MP

Guitar Maniac
Posts: 45
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Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by Guitar Maniac » Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:15 am

georgemarousi wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:50 pm
Just to highly advice everyone to go to a luthier for a proper nut - saddle setup!

Difficult pieces like the above ( which I fight with too by the way ) are processes where a very good setup is a must! :)


edit: this piece was the reason to retry to better solve me hooked nails issue ( have already had done guitar's setups done OK ). At difficult levels you need all your weapons armed !
Hooked nails is also a problem which drives me nuts, all my i m a nails curve towards their left and right edges and slightly curve downwards, with i nail extremely curves to edges and that makes my i finger catching the strings every single stroke :( I've tried with ramp shape but it simply doesn't work for me.
nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 11:56 am
Maybe you can have additional nut and saddle with narrower strings spacing which I mean adjustment... 22 cm is big enough for 650 I think... My hand is 18.5 - 19 cm only...so I have 630,635... guitars...
Thank you and georgemarousi, I'll take further adjustments into consideration if in the end I still struggle with this piece.

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georgemarousi
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Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by georgemarousi » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:16 am

Guitar Maniac wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:15 am
georgemarousi wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:50 pm
Just to highly advice everyone to go to a luthier for a proper nut - saddle setup!

Difficult pieces like the above ( which I fight with too by the way ) are processes where a very good setup is a must! :)


edit: this piece was the reason to retry to better solve me hooked nails issue ( have already had done guitar's setups done OK ). At difficult levels you need all your weapons armed !
Hooked nails is also a problem which drives me nuts, all my i m a nails curve towards their left and right edges and slightly curve downwards, with i nail extremely curves to edges and that makes my i finger catching the strings every single stroke :( I've tried with ramp shape but it simply doesn't work for me.
nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 11:56 am
Maybe you can have additional nut and saddle with narrower strings spacing which I mean adjustment... 22 cm is big enough for 650 I think... My hand is 18.5 - 19 cm only...so I have 630,635... guitars...
Thank you and georgemarousi, I'll take further adjustments into consideration if in the end I still struggle with this piece.
Hi !

check this thread, has great advice in it :

viewtopic.php?f=87&t=53890&p=1203106#p1203106

( sorry for the off topic )
--Classicals--
Paulino Bernabe Especial 2009
Ramirez 1A 1980
Alhambra Luthier india 2012
Juan Martinez nr 55 (the return @2014)
Yamaha cg 110 (as a kid @88)
--
student again since 2015, to my degree @..? - God bless!

Guitar Maniac
Posts: 45
Joined: Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:19 pm

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by Guitar Maniac » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:55 am

georgemarousi wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:16 am
Hi !

check this thread, has great advice in it :

viewtopic.php?f=87&t=53890&p=1203106#p1203106

( sorry for the off topic )
:merci: I may give it a try

Luis_Br
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Location: Brazil

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by Luis_Br » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:50 pm

Yes, and also this adjustments change with time, as you get better and try different techniques and look for different kind of sound (adjustment may interfere with sound result or it might be different according to the way you pluck etc.).

nmshu1
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Location: Los Angeles, California, USA

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:43 am

Guitar Maniac wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:15 am
georgemarousi wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:50 pm
Just to highly advice everyone to go to a luthier for a proper nut - saddle setup!

Difficult pieces like the above ( which I fight with too by the way ) are processes where a very good setup is a must! :)


edit: this piece was the reason to retry to better solve me hooked nails issue ( have already had done guitar's setups done OK ). At difficult levels you need all your weapons armed !
Hooked nails is also a problem which drives me nuts, all my i m a nails curve towards their left and right edges and slightly curve downwards, with i nail extremely curves to edges and that makes my i finger catching the strings every single stroke :( I've tried with ramp shape but it simply doesn't work for me.
nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 11:56 am
Maybe you can have additional nut and saddle with narrower strings spacing which I mean adjustment... 22 cm is big enough for 650 I think... My hand is 18.5 - 19 cm only...so I have 630,635... guitars...
Thank you and georgemarousi, I'll take further adjustments into consideration if in the end I still struggle with this piece.
I went to local famous luthier to make many bone nuts for my four concert guitars...try to find the best balance between best sound and best playability...
Otto Vowinkel 650, Cedar/BRW; Córdoba C9 650 A&B, Cedar/MH;
Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/IRW; Sweet Tone 640, Spruce/Lam. RW;
German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/MP; German V. Rubio 635, Spruce/PE;
Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top/MP

meouzer
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Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 8:35 pm
Location: Grand Junction, Colorado

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by meouzer » Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:05 pm

I just started up again after a few years. I had the string spacing reduced to the acoustic guitar level. I measured the total distance between E strings
and had a luthier make a slotted nut for that. For a man, my hand size is probably on the small side of average, and I thought for a while that reduced string spacing would help my right hand be more efficient. I am currently going back and forth between my two nuts. Currently I like the reduced spacing best, and will stick with that for awhile. I will have to post again in 6 months to give a better opinion.

Sean Eric Howard
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Location: Owensboro, Kentucky

Re: Anyone did guitar adjustment for playability

Post by Sean Eric Howard » Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:53 am

meouzer wrote:
Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:05 pm
I am currently going back and forth between my two nuts.
8) This gave a great laugh!
"Besides, this criticism of Segovia is pointless. If you disagree with what Segovia did, take that energy and go out and do something positive. Otherwise, shut up." - Eliot Fisk

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