Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

User avatar
michaelcng
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:52 am
Location: Los Angeles

Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by michaelcng » Mon Jan 08, 2018 1:22 am

Anyone have any experience with this model-spruce top & maple back/sides? I don't see any sound clips or videos of it online. I've also tried to do a search on these forums and it has come up a few times but nothing particularly in-depth.

Was going to go with the student model, but I found this one for under a $1000 and I couldn't pass it up (ended up being the only bidder on e - b a y with a low min bid).

Any string recommendations?

User avatar
Debussychopin
Posts: 575
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 6:00 am
Location: Orange County, California

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by Debussychopin » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:21 pm

it is a steal if there is nothing undisclosed about it. Those guitars run around 3-4000 dollars I would make a lot of inquiries and ask for specific photos before making the deal. Unless it is some reputable reseller or store. It may be just a one-off made for a canceled order and now just want to clear it so if that is the case , you got a good deal then

Yamaha GL1

User avatar
michaelcng
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:52 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by michaelcng » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:36 pm

I asked for a bunch of pictures and there are just a few nail scratches from what I see.

Hopefully, it turns out well.

Ramon Amira
Teacher
Posts: 3072
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:44 am
Location: New York City

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by Ramon Amira » Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:21 pm

There's an old aphorism that says if it looks too good to be true, it probably isn't. If I were you I would ask a lot of questions and do a lot of investigating. A Francisco Navarro Hauser is a terrific sounding - and looking - instrument, that even used is worth way more. Under $1000 is ... er . . . too good to be true.

Ramon
Classical and Flamenco guitar lessons via Skype worldwide - Classical and Flamenco guitars from Spain

soltirefa
Posts: 1600
Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2006 3:59 am
Location: Southern California

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by soltirefa » Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:39 pm

if it looks too good to be true, it probably isn't
I believe the expression goes, "If it seems too good to be true, it probably is."

LBrandt
Posts: 818
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2011 1:40 am

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by LBrandt » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:24 pm

Yes, I would definitely be cautious of such a bargain.

Ramon Amira
Teacher
Posts: 3072
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:44 am
Location: New York City

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by Ramon Amira » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:34 pm

soltirefa wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:39 pm
if it looks too good to be true, it probably isn't
I believe the expression goes, "If it seems too good to be true, it probably is."
Well, means the same thing either way. Of course as with most adages it has its opposite - "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth." Or in this case, "Don't look a gift guitar in the sound hole."

But for me, I would look with a microscope. It doesn't make sense. The first time I played one of Francisco's Special Grand Concert models - a Miguel Rodriguez - I played one note on the first string and gave a start. It sounded extraordinary. I could hardly stop playing it. I haven't played his Hauser, but there's every reason to think that it sounds just as good.

Now unless an elephant sat on it, how can a guitar like that be selling for less than $1000? There's a Navarro Rodriguez for sale on the Forum right now - $3200. I suppose anything's possible, but I see a red flag waving. As I said, "If it seems too good to be true, it probably is."

Ramon
Classical and Flamenco guitar lessons via Skype worldwide - Classical and Flamenco guitars from Spain

soltirefa
Posts: 1600
Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2006 3:59 am
Location: Southern California

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by soltirefa » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:08 am

If it seems (too good to be true), then it probably is (too good to be true).

MessyTendon
Amateur luthier
Posts: 1538
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:33 am

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by MessyTendon » Wed Jan 10, 2018 3:57 am

Stop insinuating the worst...He got a great deal, that's that.

Now let him try a half a dozen string sets :)

It's probably a bargain because the re-sale market on classical guitars is terrible. If it were an American shop Stratocaster, that would be a different story. It's a Navvaro, a relatively esoteric, small brand.

Enjoy the guitar, and don't worry :)

Ramon Amira
Teacher
Posts: 3072
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:44 am
Location: New York City

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by Ramon Amira » Wed Jan 10, 2018 4:44 pm

MessyTendon wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2018 3:57 am
Stop insinuating the worst...He got a great deal, that's that.

Now let him try a half a dozen string sets :)

It's probably a bargain because the re-sale market on classical guitars is terrible. If it were an American shop Stratocaster, that would be a different story. It's a Navvaro, a relatively esoteric, small brand.

Enjoy the guitar, and don't worry :)
1) P.T. Barnum would love you.

2) It's easy for you to say - it's not YOUR money. Are you prepared to reimburse him if it's a scam.

3) Simple logic and common sense would tell anyone that a guitar selling for less than $1000 that regularly sells for more than $3000 calls for caution and prudence. I never said he shouldn't buy it - merely that he should investigate it thoroughly.

4) Gratuitous disparaging remarks about Francisco Navarro's guitars are ill-informed. "Esoteric" and "small" are not adjectives that come to mind to anyone who has played any of his Special Grand Concert guitars. I have played many, and over the years I have also played countless luthier guitars by "name" (big?) luthiers, and Francisco's guitars easily rival any of them. Francisco is a well known and widely respected luthier, whose guitars consistently get outstanding reviews. They're hardly esoteric.

By the way, have you ever played one?

Ramon
Classical and Flamenco guitar lessons via Skype worldwide - Classical and Flamenco guitars from Spain

hesson11
Posts: 538
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2008 10:48 pm

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by hesson11 » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:27 am

I know this isn't a vocabulary thread, but in fairness to Messy, I'd say "esoteric" and "small" could apply to any number of luthiers or boutique workshops that we routinely discuss and revere. "Small" of course, is relative. And relative to, say, Rodriguez, Cordoba, Yamaha and many others, Navarro could certainly be thought of as a "small" maker.

Esoteric online definition: "intended for or likely to be understood by only a small number of people with a specialized knowledge or interest."

i.e., they are not mass-market products. I certainly would not consider either word disparaging or negative in any way.
-Bob

MessyTendon
Amateur luthier
Posts: 1538
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:33 am

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by MessyTendon » Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:03 am

No Ramon, I haven't, but deals are out there. Maybe, just maybe this individual got a great deal...They are out there.

Let's stop being pessimistic and wish him luck.

Ramon Amira
Teacher
Posts: 3072
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 12:44 am
Location: New York City

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by Ramon Amira » Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:18 pm

hesson11 wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:27 am
I know this isn't a vocabulary thread, but in fairness to Messy, I'd say "esoteric" and "small" could apply to any number of luthiers or boutique workshops that we routinely discuss and revere. "Small" of course, is relative. And relative to, say, Rodriguez, Cordoba, Yamaha and many others, Navarro could certainly be thought of as a "small" maker.

Esoteric online definition: "intended for or likely to be understood by only a small number of people with a specialized knowledge or interest."

i.e., they are not mass-market products. I certainly would not consider either word disparaging or negative in any way.
-Bob
Well, "small" is an ambiguous word in the context, that I interpreted to mean "insignificant." But if it meant "volume," the guitars you cite are all factory guitars, and obviously no luthier can come close to the output of a factory.

But if the criterion is to be the volume of a luthier's output, then we would have to compare Francisco's output with that of other luthiers to see if it is in fact "small." No figures are available, but from what I know based on long experience, I am confident that Francisco's output exceeds that of the majority of luthiers, and consequently could hardly be described as small.

With respect to "esoteric," since classical guitar is itself esoteric, and thus the work of any luthier even more so, then to describe Francisco's guitars as esoteric would be pointless in an absolute sense. Hence my understanding that the term was employed in a relative sense, relative to other luthiers, and consequently can reasonably be interpreted as diminishing.

And It is not "pessimistic" to advise prudence. I hope it is all legit. If it is, he's getting one of the best deals I have heard of in a long time.

Well, in the end all this doesn't mean much in the scheme of eternity. I have to get back to work on my tremolo version of "Three Blind Mice."

Ramon
Classical and Flamenco guitar lessons via Skype worldwide - Classical and Flamenco guitars from Spain

LBrandt
Posts: 818
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2011 1:40 am

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by LBrandt » Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:44 pm

Well, unless Michael posts again after he's received the guitar, we'll never know how good a deal it was. We all hope that it is a very good deal.

User avatar
Hotsoup
Posts: 201
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:11 pm
Location: Bellingham, WA (USA)

Re: Francisco Navarro Grand Concert Hauser

Post by Hotsoup » Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:45 pm

I think I found the completed listing. Looks fairly legit to me. If it is, helluva deal! Congrats

Return to “Advice on buying, selling or valuing a guitar”