Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

nmshu1
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Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:15 am

Anyone knows sound quality differences of 12-holes' tie and 6-holes' tie
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David Norton
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by David Norton » Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:39 am

Pretty much none. I have a couple of guitars with 12 hole bridges, and I test-drove them with traditional 6-hole tie methods. If there was a difference it was entirely in my imagination. Some people will undoubtedly dispute this, but some people also claim to be able to determine the gender of a honeybee by the pitch of its buzzing.....
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Philosopherguy
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by Philosopherguy » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:11 am

I've had both and I didn't detect any difference. Like David, I tried the guitars that I have owned with 12 hold tie bridges tied in both ways.

That being said, I'm not a huge fan of 12 hole ties. A 12 hole tie is the only string I have ever had slip and make a ding in a soundboard. So, I personally do everything with a traditional tie. But, a 12 hole tie is versatile in that you can do either. So, it can be good for resale, as some people love them.

Martin
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nmshu1
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:22 am

Philosopherguy wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:11 am
I've had both and I didn't detect any difference. Like David, I tried the guitars that I have owned with 12 hold tie bridges tied in both ways.

That being said, I'm not a huge fan of 12 hole ties. A 12 hole tie is the only string I have ever had slip and make a ding in a soundboard. So, I personally do everything with a traditional tie. But, a 12 hole tie is versatile in that you can do either. So, it can be good for resale, as some people love them.

Martin
About 12 holes' tie, I had slip two times. About 6 holes' tie, I have had never slip.
2014 Otto Vowinkel Concert 650, Cedar/Brazilian Rosewood
2015 Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/Indian Rosewood
2016 German V. Rubio Concert 635, Spruce/Flamed Maple
2015 Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top(Spruce/Cedar)/Flamed Maple

astro64
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by astro64 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:07 am

If you tie the strings correctly they will never slip on either bridge design. if you want to test if there is a sound difference, you can always choose to tie a 12 hole bridge as if it is a 6-hole bridge.

nmshu1
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:42 am

astro64 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:07 am
If you tie the strings correctly they will never slip on either bridge design. if you want to test if there is a sound difference, you can always choose to tie a 12 hole bridge as if it is a 6-hole bridge.
I mean at 12 holes' tie design, you may have two kinds of ties: 12holes' tie and traditional 6 holes' tie.

Does anyone has the experience changing 12 holes' tie back to traditional 6 holes' tie?

It seems different?
2014 Otto Vowinkel Concert 650, Cedar/Brazilian Rosewood
2015 Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/Indian Rosewood
2016 German V. Rubio Concert 635, Spruce/Flamed Maple
2015 Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top(Spruce/Cedar)/Flamed Maple

celestemcc
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by celestemcc » Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:10 pm

Interesting....I've never had a slip since I started using 12 holes. I find it easier and more secure. No difference in sound that I can determine. My guitar came tied as a 6-hole, then I discovered it had 12. Haven't looked back.
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Brynmor
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by Brynmor » Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:49 pm

I don't know about sound differences but when Julian Bream tried my Ambridge Hauser model, before I took delivery, he said that the guitar did not work properly using the 12 hole system. Changing to the 6 hole system made a noticeable difference, apparently, and he then expressed approval of the guitar. I have always used the 6 hole system so I can't comment further.

johnd
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by johnd » Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:11 pm

The string vibrates from the nut to the saddle. Why would there be any difference between 6 and 12 holes? I think some people have a "Ear Imagination".

Mr.Rain
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by Mr.Rain » Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:15 pm

The only effect is the angle of the string over the saddle (and this only in some cases!). It is the same effect as using "beads" or other tie systems, it can alter the way the strings transmits the vibrations over the saddle, it can make a guitar overbright or help making the string feel "tighter" (in short scale instruments it is a help...)

nmshu1
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by nmshu1 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:23 pm

celestemcc wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:10 pm
Interesting....I've never had a slip since I started using 12 holes. I find it easier and more secure. No difference in sound that I can determine. My guitar came tied as a 6-hole, then I discovered it had 12. Haven't looked back.
Yes. Because it is too easier and simpler. I burned its end. But the end quickly became sand...so slip....now I do not burn the end anymore...

Today I tested my 2 guitars by myself. 12 holes' tie seems better than 6 holes' tie especially the base...
2014 Otto Vowinkel Concert 650, Cedar/Brazilian Rosewood
2015 Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/Indian Rosewood
2016 German V. Rubio Concert 635, Spruce/Flamed Maple
2015 Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top(Spruce/Cedar)/Flamed Maple

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Thura2017
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by Thura2017 » Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:07 am

I also don't notice any difference in sound quality. I prefer the look on 12 holes' tie which I think clearer.
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David Norton
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by David Norton » Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:53 am

nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:23 pm

Today I tested my 2 guitars by myself. 12 holes' tie seems better than 6 holes' tie especially the base...
Use whichever method makes you happiest....
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JohnB
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by JohnB » Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:56 am

I'm puzzled by people saying that securing the strings to a 12 hole tie block is easier and simpler. I suppose it all depends on what you are used to but I find it less fiddly and quicker using a 6 hole tie block.

I've never tried tying a 12 hole in a 6 hole fashion so I can't comment on whether there is any difference in sound quality - though, if the the sound differences are relatively small, people have to be aware of the possibility of confirmation bias (i.e. we hear what we expect/want to hear).
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nmshu1
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Re: Sound quality of 12 holes' tie and 6 holes' tie

Post by nmshu1 » Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:28 am

David Norton wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:53 am
nmshu1 wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:23 pm

Today I tested my 2 guitars by myself. 12 holes' tie seems better than 6 holes' tie especially the base...
Use whichever method makes you happiest....
Thank you.
2014 Otto Vowinkel Concert 650, Cedar/Brazilian Rosewood
2015 Juan Hernandez Torres 640, Spruce/Indian Rosewood
2016 German V. Rubio Concert 635, Spruce/Flamed Maple
2015 Kenny Hill Performance 630, Double Top(Spruce/Cedar)/Flamed Maple

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