Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Construction and repair of Classical Guitar and related instruments
Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:24 am

I’m just about done with the construction phase of my third instrument. It’s a flamenco build using plans from a 1933 Santos Hernandez. I used local Monterey Cypress and an Engalman spruce. So far things have progressed nicely.

As I begin the finishing prep my anxiety level is climbing. There are several issues that I’m hoping to find solutions for one way or another.
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Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:25 am

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Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:26 am

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Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:28 am

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Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:40 am

So here are my current challenges. I would like to fill this gap and a few smaller ones. The plan to try and clean up the shape a little and add a small splinter of the cypress. With the smaller gaps I’m hoping to find out how to make some sort of filler with sawdust.
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Anthony DeMers
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Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:45 am

I’m also hoping for some way to make these two blemishes in my rosette to be at least a little less noticeable.
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Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
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Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:53 am

I’m also looking for suggestions for the spruce top at the waste. Both sides have gap.
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Dave M
Posts: 346
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:39 pm
Location: Somerset UK

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Dave M » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:42 pm

These are classic issues with binding. I have just been cleaning up the bindings on my eighth guitar and this is probably the first time I don't have those annoying little gaps!

CA glue is a marvellous material. However it stains spruce a nasty yellow/green so on the top you need to coat thoroughly with shellac first. In particular CA soaks into the end grain so make sure these are sealed. You will still be able to see the more obvious gaps, though the smaller ones become less noticeable, but it means that you won't have dips/holes in your finish. Several goes may be needed.

Thinking on, the staining may happen with the cypress as well.

Good Luck
Dave

vesa
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Location: Sulva, Finland

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by vesa » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:11 pm

Hi Anthony

You can try to mix different sawdust with different glue
and see which comes closest to the color.
As Dave said, this is a classic mistake - how do I know it :)

Vesa
Vesa Kuokkanen

Antonio Marin nr. 813 1995 (Bouchet)
Vesa Kuokkanen 2016

Jasonm
Posts: 66
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2018 7:05 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Jasonm » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:31 pm

I actually just finished fixing bing gaps. Rather than fill big gaps on the sides I softened the glue (titebond) and gave a little clamping pressure to realign things.

khs
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:20 am
Location: SEOUL, KOREA

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by khs » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:53 am

Dear Anthony, in generl, your 3rd seems to be better than mine.
However I would recommend applying CA glue with sanding over some small (say, less than 1mm) crevices.
and inserting small wood grafts CA glue, sanding over if the defect is wider.

Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:24 am

Thanks everyone for the feedback. I look forward to sharing the results.

Echi
Posts: 306
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:14 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Echi » Fri Mar 15, 2019 10:52 am

Hi, my suggestion is to make your own filling paste made with white glue and wood dust for the top and to go for the spint for the side. Be careful that the glue always darkens the natural colour of the wood dust.
Alternatively you may try to pour some coloured shellac in the gaps (there are some shellac sticks for the purpose). Frank Ford posted a video about the latter.

Anthony DeMers
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:51 pm

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Anthony DeMers » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:26 pm

Thanks Echi.

Dave M
Posts: 346
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2014 1:39 pm
Location: Somerset UK

Re: Monterey Cypress/Engelman Spruce

Post by Dave M » Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:51 am

I should amend that - I only have a few small gaps!

I thought it worth mentioning a few things for the next build:

Getting the binding bent properly for a good fit is important. Particularly remember to bend in the vertical direction to fit round the domed back.

Something that Trevor Gore recommends is to use a strong, reinforced tape rather than ordinary masking tape. You can apply much more force with this to squeeze the recalcitrant bindings into place. This helped me a lot with this pretty sharp cutaway since I just couldn't persuade the binding to take the tight bend.

Oh and that is a good looking guitar!
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Dave

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