Is recording in sections cheating?

Creating a home studio for recording the classical guitar. Equipment, software and recording techniques. Amplification for live performance.
Conall
Posts: 524
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2017 10:26 am
Location: Scotland

Re: Is recording in sections cheating?

Post by Conall » Thu Feb 08, 2018 12:59 pm

Mark Clifton-Gaultier wrote:
Thu Feb 08, 2018 12:08 pm
Conall wrote:A professional studio recording is intended for repeated listening so needs to be as perfect as possible. Nothing irritates more than hearing or predicting a mistake at exactly the same point every single time you listen to the track.
I don't buy recorded music in order to admire the skill of the engineer. I appear to stand alone here but I find that I am indeed more irritated by the coldness of this modern style of multi-edit presentation than by the odd minor error, squeaks (or in some cases even breathing/extraneous noise) - to the extent that repeated listenings simply don't happen.

I recently bought a CD by a guitarist that I've enjoyed live many times and who's performances are full of passion, intelligence and individuality. The CD is simply not representative of their work - what incentive then for me to listen to it again?

I accept that any recording process impacts on the resultant sound - efforts to mitigate this are understandable. I prefer edits correcting performer error to be at least minimal, preferably absent.
I understand where you are coming from but there are also other reasons to try to record as close to "perfect" as possible - as a reference recording or for transcribing from the recording for example. There enough poor editions of pieces which have wrong notes - add in other ones in the recording & it's not helpful!
Generally if I can't find a piece from a recording I'll try to transcribe it. Ironically once I found the sheet music for one I had transcribed I decided I preferred my version with a couple of inaccurate notes!

I also accept that some studio recordings lack the atmosphere of live recordings. In pop music I much prefer Paul Simon's "live" version of Kathy's Song to his studio versions because he truly sounded "in the moment" / as if he genuinely meant & felt the words he was singing.

AndreiKrylov

Re: Is recording in sections cheating?

Post by AndreiKrylov » Thu Feb 08, 2018 3:37 pm

there is no point to write hear
no point to share ideas
no point to share experience - it won't be understood or recognized
and it will be rejected...

Sorry for bothering you with my opinion
Last edited by AndreiKrylov on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:47 pm, edited 4 times in total.

ronjazz
Posts: 884
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2011 11:10 pm

Re: Is recording in sections cheating?

Post by ronjazz » Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:23 pm

records are "big lies", all performers edit, re-record, etc., because the two-dimensional and repeated listening aspects have to be factored in.
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AndreiKrylov

Re: Is recording in sections cheating?

Post by AndreiKrylov » Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:56 pm

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Gruupi
Posts: 1197
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 12:11 am
Location: Dallas, TX

Re: Is recording in sections cheating?

Post by Gruupi » Sat Feb 17, 2018 1:24 pm

A great recording sounds inspired and not sterile, regardless of whether it was edited or one take. Some artists can sound sterile when trying to record in one take because they are focused on not making mistakes. Others sound sterile when piecing together multiple takes because they never get into the flow. I personally don't care one way or another how the final result is achieved. I don't want to hear obvious edits or obvious mistakes, but then again, when I listen to music I don't listen for mistakes, I listen for enjoyment or inspiration.

MikeTaylor
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 56
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:28 am
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Is recording in sections cheating?

Post by MikeTaylor » Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:14 pm

Very nice analogies AndreiKrylov. I have been struggling with this same question and I only record for my own enjoyment. You refocus the problem in a very clear way. Thanks
“Would you tell me, please, which way I ought to go from here?"
"That depends a good deal on where you want to get to"
"I don't much care where–"
"Then it doesn't matter which way you go”
― Lewis Carroll, Alice in Wonderland

AndreiKrylov

Re: Is recording in sections cheating?

Post by AndreiKrylov » Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:20 pm

Sorry I pushed wrong button...
but here is my analysis anyway

Yes, I agree that repeating or re-recording could not always bring best results. Yes sometimes it does not work. Probably because one of the most important element in work (recording in this case) is inspiration and it is not constant thing and could come and leave...
But artist should have freedom and possibility to use all kind of technical means to express himself when he inspired.

As far as this: "sheet music isn't a performance, painting isn't a performance, composing isn't a performance, writing a book isn't a performance."
No, I disagree.
It is not performance only in a way that it is not used to be a performance in our culture, but put people on stage and let them draw - it would be a performance! It could be even more attractive for audience than classical guitar, depending how it presented... :)
Same could happen with writing of sheet music, composing or writing a book.... just put people who do that on stage, bring audience - and it would be performance.

To make it very simple we could say: when someone plays - his brains working and his hands/fingers moving and he produce sound picture as a result of this work of brain and hands/fingers.

But what is the difference with the writer? - his brains working and his fingers moving and he produce text (which is actually sound as well) as a result of this work of brain and hands/fingers .

And what about painter? - his brains working and his fingers moving and he produce picture as a result of this work of brain and hands/fingers .

So basically in all cases it is combined work of our brains and hands/fingers.
All of it is a performance in a way that to be as productive as possible and as perfect as possible we need to have the best possible performance of our brains and hands/fingers (therefore as best as possible physical condition of our bodies) , therefore in all cases we we have to have the best possible performance of our bodies for best results...
Then second thing. Most of (guitar) recordings nowadays happening when someone alone recording in studio or by himself using (working by) his brains and his hands/fingers moving and producing sound picture as a result of this work of brain and hands/fingers.

What is the difference with writer, composer or artist??
He also working alone himself using (working by) his brains and his hands/fingers moving and producing sound picture as a result of this work of brain and hands/fingers.

Certainly someone could say that he want to record his (hands/fingers?) performance for the time only... and probably he does not care if he will achieve the best result (beautiful music?) and do not want to please ears/souls of others with music, but just want to be as "HONEST" as possible... and that is the best way to do for everybody else....

Then maybe, maybe there are some people (listeners) who interested not in the beautiful music, but in "Honesty" only. But probably not many... and isn't "Honesty" about himself a bit strange purpose for Art?

Myself, when I am recording - I prefer to record piece in one take, when I am inspired.
But if this would not work - I would do more takes and record in sections. And yes I prefer and always trying to finish all in one take.
But not because of "honesty" or "honest reflection of my performance" - NO!
I do not make music for performance, I do not care about performance, performance not thing I even think about at all! I have Music in me... and it is overwhelming me and I have to record this Music, because it is beautiful and inspiring (for me), so this Music will come alive and be available for others... that is why I am recording Music in general.
Performance ? Competitions ? Particular audience of particular place?
- I do not give a damn about all those things. My purpose is just a record of Music itself. Music as a sound picture, sound world, poetic description of this and other worlds.
Music as a performance ? For judgement ? Competition ?
No thanks. Not interested!!!
AndreiKrylov wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2015 3:44 pm
I made many live videos... :)
here some of them...




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