D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

The classical guitar lessons are free. They are aimed at the isolated amateur who does not have access to a teacher. To join the class, apply for registration into the students group.
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The classical guitar lessons are free. They are aimed at the isolated amateur who does not have access to a teacher. To join the class, apply for registration into the students group.

PDF, MP3, Vidéos, Lessons : Level D01 - Level D02 - Level D03 - Level D04 - Level D05 - Level D06 - Level D07 - Level D08 - Level D09 - Level D10 - Level D11 - Level D12.
Craig McCallum
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Craig McCallum » Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:24 am

Apologies for not being around much this month - after being late getting started on this month's lessons, I was sick for a week, and we've had decorators in the house this week, so not much time for practicing/recording.

I'll try to get videos up this weekend - they're likely to be a little rough since I've had limited practice time this month.

Yucel Kamcez
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Yucel Kamcez » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:27 pm

Juan M Silva wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:27 pm
Yucel Kamcez wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:30 pm
Hi, everyone,

Have a nice day! I hadn't enough time to make practise but i tried to do my best. I hope you gonna enjoy

Sincerely,
Yucel
WOW! :shock:
For someone who didn't have enough time to practice, you got homeruns on these pieces!
Thank you for posting all of the exercises, there is a nice consistency on your work. 'Leccion 5a' was a beautiful execution.
I do have an observation, and it is not related to the quality of tone I perceived.
For the 'Chemim' piece, I noticed that you opted to not go with the thumb (P) on the base strings. Any particular reason for opting to go i,m on those?
In my case, I ended up using i,m on the 7th bar when going from that G to the F and E. Making that transition from i,m to P was a train wreck for me every time. I'll continue practicing that transition.
I have been tinkering around with the 'Sagreras First Lessons', and in those first lessons the upper strings are also played with i,m. The P is introduced later in the book. So, the i,m fingering is comfortable for me too.
Great work!!

Warm Regards,
Juan
Hi Juan & Angela and of course, all friends!

Many times i see your positive comments and I couldn't respond to your comments in time. I am sorry for this. Indeed, i had many personal obligations this month. I try to follow your works. I am learning many things in your comments and i am aware of my playing in the problems about right hand using. For instance, I find it easier to use thumb for base string. No any other special reason for that. I realize that this might cause problems in the future. I see you everyone putting serious effort to play correctly and it makes me happy. Because i know the music is a serious hobby and i feel we are in the right way together.

With my best wishes,
Yucel

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James A. Showalter
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by James A. Showalter » Sun Dec 03, 2017 7:52 pm

I 2nd Craig's dilemma.

Not so much as bad health or other people taking my time,... I'm just busy loving the fine fall weather and all it offers.

I hope to catch up but probably not before the end of the year.
James
1972 Ryoji Matsuoka, NO 18
1990 Takamine C132S
2014 Sakurai Kohno Pro-J
Martin Guitars (D28, MC28, D12-28, J-40)
National Resonator Guitar
Les Paul

Tales Lucin
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Tales Lucin » Thu Dec 14, 2017 12:38 am

My submission:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

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James A. Showalter
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by James A. Showalter » Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:30 pm

Stopped whining, submitted Lesson-3 and moving on to Lesson-4.
Last edited by James A. Showalter on Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
1972 Ryoji Matsuoka, NO 18
1990 Takamine C132S
2014 Sakurai Kohno Pro-J
Martin Guitars (D28, MC28, D12-28, J-40)
National Resonator Guitar
Les Paul

Jules Wilkins
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Posts: 154
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Jules Wilkins » Thu Dec 28, 2017 6:36 am

Hello all
I am a late comer catching up but before making my submissions I thought I would comment on at least a couple of things:

James: I think you have a serious typo in your posting. It reads that you cannot mute with your thumb. Clearly you omitted the crucial word "yet". There were some exercises in the previous lesson as I recall that addressed that specific talent and you may want to review them. As for the specific piece, just practice the one or two bars over and over again starting as slowly as necessary for you to accomplish it. Speed will follow. What you are doing is training your muscles and brain to perform a task they have never had to do before. Seriously though...you can do it, it is easy (or at least that is what you must tell yourself), and you are a winner.

Yucel: Take a listen at your submission. Do you hear that scraping sound? That has to be your nails rubbing against the strings. It is not a sound you want to interfere with your renditions and it is only a matter of isolating the issue. My best guess is that your nails are actually too long and/or they are too rough. I am not going to profess to offer a one-sentence solution other than to say that your nails need to be long enough to finally sound the strings but no longer and that they need to be highly polished. There are several excellent youtube lessons on nail care. It is something of a pain to have to tend to one's nails when you want to get on with your lessons (for me at least), but for the few minutes involved it does pay huge dividends.

General notes to all:
1) As several of you have noticed several pieces are written one way (using the thumb on base notes) and played another in the opening video examples. It would be nice if one of the instructors chimed in, but my theory is that playing with the thumb is more difficult for sure, especially dealing with the string transitions from thumb to fingers, but in the long run it is also more beneficial. In other words, it is hardly required in the example pieces but once we get to more technical material anyone who has mastered the pieces as written will be glad they took the extra effort. As an aside, it makes some of the muting easier. I for one am playing the pieces as written.
2) As for strings vibrating without having touched them, this is normal and generally desirable, but it can also be a negative. Basically things like the tops of our guitars have natural harmonic frequencies. If you have ever watched a master luthier construct a custom guitar (s)he will spend a great deal of time ensuring that the tops respond to all the frequencies it is likely to encounter rather than favoring just a few, or at least that is my understanding. I am playing on a mass produced instrument that does at least have a solid wood top, but it responds very well to some notes and not so well to others. The problem is that even damping certain notes as these lessons are having us do so religiously it does not dampen the sound as when I struck the note it caused the top to vibrate (as it should, for that is where the sound comes from) which in turn causes other strings to sound (natural harmonic frequencies). The real issue is that it does this to a much greater extent with some notes than with others. Some sounds can be effectively damped (never 100% but to a great extent) while damping other notes is materially less effective. If anyone wants a real life example of natural harmonic frequencies then look up the Tacoma Narrows Bridge on youtube. This is required viewing for engineering students and highly recommended for anyone wanting to understand the subject.
"We all need people who will give us feedback. That’s how we improve." — Bill Gates
"The biggest room in the world is the room for improvement." — unknown

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James A. Showalter
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by James A. Showalter » Thu Dec 28, 2017 7:04 pm

Hello Jules.

Thanks for the encouragement.

I remember well the video of the Tacoma Narrows Bridge. It was required viewing in one of my Physics classes where we studied natural harmonic resonance. And thanks for the memory.

James
1972 Ryoji Matsuoka, NO 18
1990 Takamine C132S
2014 Sakurai Kohno Pro-J
Martin Guitars (D28, MC28, D12-28, J-40)
National Resonator Guitar
Les Paul

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James A. Showalter
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Posts: 154
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:20 pm
Location: Mississippi

Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by James A. Showalter » Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:28 pm

So I'm going to catch up on Lesson-3 now and then move on.

Of course my left hand still dances like a drunken sailor and my right hand is totally ineffective at silencing him so my damping is poor.

Here are my submissions:

DO1 L-3 Si Si Re


DO1 L-3 Good Morning To All


DO1 L-3 Leccion 5A


And the corrected-
DO1 L-3 Lo, nous marchons sur un e'troit chemin


Movin' on up.
James
Last edited by James A. Showalter on Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
1972 Ryoji Matsuoka, NO 18
1990 Takamine C132S
2014 Sakurai Kohno Pro-J
Martin Guitars (D28, MC28, D12-28, J-40)
National Resonator Guitar
Les Paul

Jules Wilkins
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 154
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:12 pm

Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Jules Wilkins » Sat Dec 30, 2017 7:32 am

Hello James:
I am going to offer my 2 cents on just one of your submissions, that being "Lo, Nous Marchons Sur Un Etroit Chemin". Ok, it will more likely be at least 10 cents by the time I'm finished, but hopefully money well spent :D
1) You are doing rest strokes with your thumb. That is a major accomplishment. Of the four possible strokes (free and rest, both for fingers and thumb) this is the most difficult to master. You are also switching to a finger rest stroke when you get to the third string, which is not an easy transition. That is the way the piece is written and kudos to you for a valiant effort!
2) You already know about your dancing left hand to which I will add that your index finger is standing at attention throughout. I guess it figures because he isn't needed in this piece he can take a rest, but you must tell him otherwise. All fingers should be in a ready position at all times for otherwise they are learning that it is OK to be anywhere they feel like. To calm your hand and train the fingers to be "at the ready" I strongly recommend starting each lesson with a warmup exercise of the chromatic scale. Start at just the first string (e,f,f#,g,g#,g,f#,f,e repeating several times) While ascending hold each finger down and try to hit every note with the tip of your applicable finger just back of the fret with just enough pressure to sound the note perfectly. When descending lift the no-longer-needed finger just as you strike the string but keep it within half an inch of the string always in the ready position. Go as slow as needed to to maintain correct finger placement. When you can do the first string perfectly for 3 times at a reasonable pace introduce the second string so you are now playing b through G# and back again leaving every finger in place until it is needed somewhere else. I guarantee that this will improve your left hand dramatically. Just tell those pesky fingers that you are in charge.
3) In the music there is a :‖ symbol at the end of the fifth measure. It is telling you to play those first 5 bars again before proceeding.
4) When you play the rest stroke, be it with the thumb or the fingers, your hand should be still. The movement should be coming from the thumb (in this piece) or the finger (in other pieces) Try placing the fingers on the first, second and third strings when doing the stroke. Your thumb rest stroke movement is about 60% thumb and 40% hand. Now...to change from rest stroke thumb to rest stroke finger your hand will need to change position, and you might even try to sound that third string A with comparable strength to your thumb strokes but that is a minor point.
5) It could be the camera angle, but I don't think so...you should review your seating position and there is too much written on this which is easy to find for me to suggest specifics other than a correct position will put the head of your guitar at roughly the same level as your eyes. I think you will find that the head of your guitar is about 8 inches too low, at least for classical music. It will be extremely difficult to correct hand positions and keep them steady if your basic sitting position is wrong, so this should arguably have been my first point and the first thing you should attempt to correct.

For what it is worth, after viewing your submissions in earlier lessons I see definite progress so good for you, but before you get too far you really need to correct your basic seating and hand positions, imho. Good luck and keep up the good work.

If you don't know what I mean by the chromatic scale exercise I will post a video for you.
"We all need people who will give us feedback. That’s how we improve." — Bill Gates
"The biggest room in the world is the room for improvement." — unknown

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James A. Showalter
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by James A. Showalter » Sat Dec 30, 2017 4:59 pm

Jules,
Thank you for spending so much effort on my behalf. Your contribution is much more than a tuppence. It has the value of silver.

I understand clearly all of your recommendations and will do my best to modify my play following your guidance. However, you must realize that I am playing from a disadvantaged perspective. My right wrist has been fused for more than 20 years and I have no motion in it. This requires that I hold the guitar in a position that meets my wrists' ability to articulate. This is also why transitioning from thumb to finger picking to damping is so difficult for me. I lose track of where the strings are. But none of this matters to the dancing fingers of the left hand. The chromatic scale exercise is a certain path to more control and I will implement your strategy immediately. It's the old dog, new tricks syndrome. During my practice for this lesson I was concentrating very hard on keeping the left hand fingers slightly bent and in the ready position. But as a fellow student noted earlier - something happens when the record button is depressed that is not in your control. When I reviewed the videos and saw that index finger standing proud I just shook my head.

I will print your list of 5 and make each part a piece of my daily regimen.

And THANK YOU for pointing out my obvious mistake. I can't believe I actually did it but I placed the repeat of the 1st 5 measures at the end of the piece instead of at the beginning. I'll never understand my thinking on that.

Thanks so much for taking your time on my behalf.
Sincerely,
James
1972 Ryoji Matsuoka, NO 18
1990 Takamine C132S
2014 Sakurai Kohno Pro-J
Martin Guitars (D28, MC28, D12-28, J-40)
National Resonator Guitar
Les Paul

Jules Wilkins
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 154
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:12 pm

Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Jules Wilkins » Sat Dec 30, 2017 6:37 pm

Hello again James
There are no absolutes in terms of proper positions for playing the classical guitar as everyone's body is different. Playing with a fused wrist is certainly going to render whatever is best for me (and I am still searching for that) quite different from what is best for you. I play bridge with a fellow with no arms and only one leg/foot, but the dexterity in that foot and its toes is a thing to behold, so I have complete confidence in your ability to compensate for your fused wrist. Comparing your first videos to your most recent ones your body position has changed which tells me you are still searching for what works best. I have just changed chairs to something a bit higher because I felt that would be an improvement for me, and as I mentioned in a previous post I am struggling to change my left hand to a parallel position from a more comfortable slanted position. With every subtle change I make I have to retrain my fingers as to where the strings and frets are, so you are far from alone in that respect. So keep the faith and continue to experiment. I find myself looking forward to seeing how you progress. You are an inspiration to me and no doubt to our other fellow students.
"We all need people who will give us feedback. That’s how we improve." — Bill Gates
"The biggest room in the world is the room for improvement." — unknown

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James A. Showalter
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Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by James A. Showalter » Sat Dec 30, 2017 7:09 pm

Jules,
Your kind words are an uplifting gift at the close of this most difficult year.
Here's to each of us and our fellow students finding our most resonant posture in the coming New Year.
Warmest regards.
James
1972 Ryoji Matsuoka, NO 18
1990 Takamine C132S
2014 Sakurai Kohno Pro-J
Martin Guitars (D28, MC28, D12-28, J-40)
National Resonator Guitar
Les Paul

Jules Wilkins
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 154
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:12 pm

Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Jules Wilkins » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:24 pm

I have seen a few comments about how hitting the record button seems to completely thrown ones ability to play up to the standards they know they are capable of out the window. Perhaps this is good preparation for when the time comes when we can start to perform for an audience. What I would like to know is if there are any among us who are posting their first attempts at any but the simplest exercises. I venture to guess that we all suffer from this malady. For me, Leccion 5A was an extremely difficult piece to get more or less right. Practice, practice, record, oops, practice, oops, practice, that's better, practice, record, oops and so on for far too long. I still haven't nailed it and certainly haven't experimented with timbre, but I hope at least that it is close.



"We all need people who will give us feedback. That’s how we improve." — Bill Gates
"The biggest room in the world is the room for improvement." — unknown

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James A. Showalter
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Posts: 154
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:20 pm
Location: Mississippi

Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by James A. Showalter » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:22 am

Jules,
Some of us found that in the beginning the hardest part was getting YOUTUBE to work properly. It appears you are having a similar difficulty.

My problem was that I inserted the whole YOUTUBE address into the switch. You only put that 11-character gibberish line between the YOUTUBES [Y]*[Y]. Put the gibberish where I have the asterisk. I'm just using Y to represent YOUTUBE because if I get too explicit it errors. I hope that helps.

I am very interested in seeing your play.

I've also repaired my submission for Lo Nous Marchons Sur Un Etroit Chemin. Let me know what you think.
Thanks
James
1972 Ryoji Matsuoka, NO 18
1990 Takamine C132S
2014 Sakurai Kohno Pro-J
Martin Guitars (D28, MC28, D12-28, J-40)
National Resonator Guitar
Les Paul

Jules Wilkins
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 154
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:12 pm

Re: D01 Classical guitar lesson 03

Post by Jules Wilkins » Sun Dec 31, 2017 6:09 pm

Happy new year James
I am puzzled by your comments regarding YouTube. I have only inserted the file number (what you referred to as the gibberish) and on my computer everything shows perfectly, on this and every other submission I have made. It shows a picture of me with a play arrow which I click to watch the video file, no different than what I see for your submissions. Are you telling me that you see something different and cannot open the files?

Yes, I watched your resubmitted rendition of Lo Nous Marchons Sur Un Etroit Chemin, and there is clearly improvement. The first thing I notice is that you are still experimenting with your overall position, this time using a pillow to prop up your guitar with the result that you are much closer to the "standard" recommended position for classical guitar. It certainly doesn't seem to impede your ability to play though with every change you make it takes time to adjust. You of course played the notes in the right order this time and both hands showed improvement. Moving in the right direction is always beneficial. Keep up the good work.
"We all need people who will give us feedback. That’s how we improve." — Bill Gates
"The biggest room in the world is the room for improvement." — unknown

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