driverless cars

Talk about things that are not necessarily related to music or the guitar.
User avatar
Michael.N.
Posts: 7022
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:28 am
Location: UK

Re: driverless cars

Post by Michael.N. » Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:29 am

I was brought up on radio and TV repairs (father). I think back to what TV's were like in the early 70's - largely a mixture of thermionic valves (tubes), transistors and even a very simple integrated circuit or two. Compare that to a TV is the late 90's and it's almost a different beast altogether. it essentially does the same thing but has become far far more reliable (hence why TV repair engineers have all but disappeared). The CRT has disappeared, it's far slimmer and far lighter in weight. I also agree about the electric car. Key to that is lower costs of offshore (it's falling rapidly) and the further development of battery storage capacity/cost.
Historicalguitars.

User avatar
Denian Arcoleo
Composer
Posts: 6132
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2006 3:39 pm
Location: Somerset, England

Re: driverless cars

Post by Denian Arcoleo » Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:41 pm

Electric cars are most definitely a good thing and will, I'm sure, be on our streets fairly soon in big numbers. Personally I can't wait, mainly because of the improvement in urban air quality that will come with them. I have always felt that the internal combustion engine was one of the worst inventions ever devised; a fume-belching monster that destroys the environment.

simonm
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7656
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 am
Location: Germany, Würzburg. Spain, IB

Re: driverless cars

Post by simonm » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:04 pm

Denian Arcoleo wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:41 pm
... I have always felt that the internal combustion engine was one of the worst inventions ever devised; a fume-belching monster that destroys the environment.
The combination of cars and expanding population completely changed the face of the planet in a very short period. Everything is built around providing space for cars and everything that is around them. The scene in this movie https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Les_Visiteurs when they see a modern road for the first time is actually quite telling.

Andrew Pohlman
Posts: 1272
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:24 pm
Location: SF Bay Area

Re: driverless cars

Post by Andrew Pohlman » Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:04 pm

Denian Arcoleo wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:41 pm
Electric cars are most definitely a good thing and will, I'm sure, be on our streets fairly soon in big numbers. Personally I can't wait, mainly because of the improvement in urban air quality that will come with them. I have always felt that the internal combustion engine was one of the worst inventions ever devised; a fume-belching monster that destroys the environment.
The beauty of electric vehicles is that the energy powering them can come from many different sources. Worst case, fossil fuel can be used to charge your batteries. But wind and solar, hydroelectric, hydrogen, biomass and methane are all usable for electric cars in one way or another with varying efficiency. The big problem currently is energy storage. Far better batteries with far better life spans will be needed. $10K to swap out a defunct battery pack is just too expensive.

To stay on topic, a self driving electric car could simply drop you off at work, find a charging station, and be ready to drive you home without any effort by the passenger.
2013 Rodriguez FF Sabicas blanco
2015 Trevor Gore custom Neoclassical
- redwood top, Palo dorado B+Ss.

simonm
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7656
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 am
Location: Germany, Würzburg. Spain, IB

Re: driverless cars

Post by simonm » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:08 pm

Andrew Pohlman wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:04 pm
...
To stay on topic, a self driving electric car could simply drop you off at work, find a charging station, and be ready to drive you home without any effort by the passenger.
The traditional car companies are working hard for this to happen. The new entrants are trying to change it so that the car will go off and pick up somebody else and then somebody else … until it is time to charge the battery at the point where it optimizes the life of the battery. A different car will pick you up. This ownership change is the "challenge" for the traditional manufacturers but the the real benefit from an environmental perspective.

Andrew Pohlman
Posts: 1272
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:24 pm
Location: SF Bay Area

Re: driverless cars

Post by Andrew Pohlman » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:50 pm

simonm wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:08 pm
Andrew Pohlman wrote:
Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:04 pm
...
To stay on topic, a self driving electric car could simply drop you off at work, find a charging station, and be ready to drive you home without any effort by the passenger.
The traditional car companies are working hard for this to happen. The new entrants are trying to change it so that the car will go off and pick up somebody else and then somebody else … until it is time to charge the battery at the point where it optimizes the life of the battery. A different car will pick you up. This ownership change is the "challenge" for the traditional manufacturers but the the real benefit from an environmental perspective.
This is not as straight forward as one might think. The most ecological method is to charge slowly during non-peak grid usage. This means that the power company will not have to provide gigantic peak capacity - doing so is very UN ecological. Furthermore, rapid charging is highly inefficient. So there is considerably less time available for driving passengers to and fro if duration of charging stays very ecological at 8-12 hours and/or during daylight hours in conjunction with solar arrays. At least, with current technology. :D

Now, I am a nurse educator in a CA state prison hospital. We attract employees who cannot get jobs anywhere else - without exaggeration - dumb and dumberer. Unlike the prison system, electric and self driving cars have the best and the brightest working toward solutions with huge potential profits as the proverbial carrot. I think I can safely predict that all engineering problems will be ironed out. Then of course, politics adds huge social complexity. But the engineering pieces will be nailed down superbly - I have no doubts.
2013 Rodriguez FF Sabicas blanco
2015 Trevor Gore custom Neoclassical
- redwood top, Palo dorado B+Ss.

simonm
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7656
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 am
Location: Germany, Würzburg. Spain, IB

Re: driverless cars

Post by simonm » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:17 pm

Andrew Pohlman wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:50 pm
…..

This is not as straight forward as one might think. The most ecological method is to charge slowly during non-peak grid usage. ...
No quibbles with that. As far as I have always understood one of the initial reasons for pushing street lighting at night was so that the electric companies could dump excess base load at night. How wonderful it would be to regain the night sky by dumping the load into cars. :-)

Zach S
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu May 19, 2011 1:55 pm

Re: driverless cars

Post by Zach S » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:58 pm

Smith wrote:
Fri Nov 24, 2017 5:10 pm
Curious that Tesla did not want to divulge the weight of their new transport truck.

It looks nice but trucking companies wanted to know how much it weighs....
Hm, it appears to be 80,000 lb fully loaded (grabbed that from the website). Not sure if that's conventional ... but the number's impressive at least!
If you have built castles in the air, your work need not be lost; that is where they should be. Now put the foundations under them. -- Henry David Thoreau

simonm
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7656
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 am
Location: Germany, Würzburg. Spain, IB

Re: driverless cars

Post by simonm » Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:58 pm

Zach S wrote:
Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:58 pm

Hm, it appears to be 80,000 lb fully loaded (grabbed that from the website). Not sure if that's conventional ... but the number's impressive at least!
The classic "standard" heavy truck in Europe is 40 tons (Ignoring long ton, short ton and metric tonne). There is a bit of variation. So the 80,000 is pretty much an international standard size. That gives you 20,000lbs for the truck and 60,000lbs for a standard 40ft international shipping container.

casy
Posts: 103
Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2014 5:57 pm
Location: Vero Beach, Fl.

Re: driverless cars

Post by casy » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:11 pm

I'm waiting for a driverless guitar so I can sit back and listen to myself play perhaps inside a driverless car.

User avatar
David Gutowski
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2016 4:14 am
Location: Southwest USA

Re: driverless cars

Post by David Gutowski » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:51 am

It's about time...car exhaust really is damaging the atmosphere. I never roll down my window when driving and I wonder if the cars filter is very effective.
3 hard things for humans: dentist visit, public speaking, offering forgiveness.

Muse: chg pitch measure rhym feel tempo improvise melody harmonize arpeggios stucco your legato & practice

Carrillo Concert
Yulong Chamber '17
Bozo 123

User avatar
Denian Arcoleo
Composer
Posts: 6132
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2006 3:39 pm
Location: Somerset, England

Re: driverless cars

Post by Denian Arcoleo » Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:32 am

Totally agree with you. But driverless cars and human-piloted electric cars are two different things. Win win is when electric cars are powered by renewable energy.

simonm
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 7656
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 am
Location: Germany, Würzburg. Spain, IB

Re: driverless cars

Post by simonm » Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:23 am

casy wrote:
Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:11 pm
I'm waiting for a driverless guitar so I can sit back and listen to myself play perhaps inside a driverless car.
Well a very similar feature has existed for a long. You hire a person called a chauffeur to drive the car. And many countries have a variation called a taxi or sometimes limousine.

Women with children are also sometimes referred to as mammy-taxis but might not take kindly to hubby playing guitar in back of car.

David Gutowski wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:51 am
It's about time...car exhaust really is damaging the atmosphere. …
5-10 days of having no aircraft in the air would likely make a major contribution to clean air in terms of greenhouse gas effects at any rate. Ditto, keeping the top 50 biggest ships from traveling for 2 weeks. I am back to seeing some of the gorgeous multicolored sunsets of my childhood. Back then it was due to coal smoke for heating, now it is due to the exhaust trails (aka con-trails or chem-trails ) from aircraft. Same bright orange and lemon colors. But the air travel and sea shipping industries have major lobbies whereas private car drivers do not.

User avatar
Michael.N.
Posts: 7022
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:28 am
Location: UK

Re: driverless cars

Post by Michael.N. » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:51 am

Air travel. People are increasingly addicted to it. I have a friend who goes on so many holidays that I'm sure he spends more time sleeping in the metal tube than his own bed. He calls himself 'green' but justifies it by saying that he doesn't own a car. I haven't seen him for 3 years. He's never in the country long enough for us to have a cup of coffee.
Historicalguitars.

User avatar
Denian Arcoleo
Composer
Posts: 6132
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2006 3:39 pm
Location: Somerset, England

Re: driverless cars

Post by Denian Arcoleo » Mon Mar 19, 2018 5:26 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... zona-tempe

first of many I have no doubt. Fact is, we're a lot smarter than machines and will be for a long long time. As Chomsky said, the singularity is science fiction.

Return to “The Café”