Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

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PeteJ
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Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by PeteJ » Wed Mar 20, 2019 12:10 pm

I expect most people know this player but I only just found him and thought I'd share this wonderful performance. .


Conall
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Conall » Thu Mar 21, 2019 7:46 pm

His playing and guitar helped to convince me to buy an 11 string guitar. I haven't played my luthier made 6 string since.

soltirefa
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by soltirefa » Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:11 pm

Conall wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 7:46 pm
His playing and guitar helped to convince me to buy an 11 string guitar. I haven't played my luthier made 6 string since.
That's interesting that it motivated you to get your 11 string. I see he uses a capo that covers the trebles at the 2nd fret and leaves the basses un-capoed. That would be an option for you if you decided you ever wanted to try it. It makes the guitar an alto guitar, effectively. I believe he reads the chaconne in B minor. This isn't his version, but just so you can see it.

http://web.archive.org/web/201012040508 ... aconne.pdf

Wasser also plays Weiss' Introduzzione, which sounds amazing.

http://web.archive.org/web/201012040636 ... zzione.pdf

Conall
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Conall » Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:13 pm

soltirefa wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:11 pm
Conall wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 7:46 pm
His playing and guitar helped to convince me to buy an 11 string guitar. I haven't played my luthier made 6 string since.
That's interesting that it motivated you to get your 11 string. I see he uses a capo that covers the trebles at the 2nd fret and leaves the basses un-capoed. That would be an option for you if you decided you ever wanted to try it. It makes the guitar an alto guitar, effectively. I believe he reads the chaconne in B minor. This isn't his version, but just so you can see it.

http://web.archive.org/web/201012040508 ... aconne.pdf

Wasser also plays Weiss' Introduzzione, which sounds amazing.

http://web.archive.org/web/201012040636 ... zzione.pdf
Partly motivated me. He shows some of the advantages of the extra strings & of course it's very resonant & he plays very well.

But I've always liked the lute and early music is my first love, particularly Bach and the chaconne is of course one of his greatest solo pieces for any instrument. 11 string guitar just allows me to play lute music more faithfully while being able to play regular guitar music on the same instrument.

I arranged the Chaconne in Em many years ago. Em is as resonant as Dm on 6 string and a similar level of difficulty but Em allows one of my favourite passages to have a middle pedal as it does on the violin (A note equivalent to 3rd string 2nd fret) as an open B.

When I got an 8 string I tried it in Cm (the open pedal = open G 3rd string) and it works quite well in that key.

But the 11 string made me go back to Em as I can play the bassline integral to much of the work with the low open basses (E,D,C,B,A occurs or is hinted at often in the minor sections).

My 11 string is pitched in E so I can play normal guitar ensemble music and because I prefer the pitch.

But if I was to buy another I might go for an altoguitar which is arguably better for Dowland's music which I also adore.

Conall
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Conall » Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:15 pm

P.s. playing the Chaconne in Bm with f# tuning would of course give you the equivalent middle pedal in that key.

Conall
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Conall » Fri Mar 22, 2019 7:57 am

Soltirefa:
Yes, Wasser's Weiss Introduzzione sounds excellent, as does his guitar! I must look for a version that will work on my guitar (or transpose the alto guitar version you sent).

Interestingly, the Bm version of the Chaconne that you posted has similar opening fingering to my Em version but a string physically higher than mine.

soltirefa
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by soltirefa » Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:21 pm

Yes, Wasser's Weiss Introduzzione sounds excellent, as does his guitar! I must look for a version that will work on my guitar (or transpose the alto guitar version you sent).
Here it is in the original key.

http://jdf.luth.pagesperso-orange.fr/Pa ... ite_27.pdf

Mickmac
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Mickmac » Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:25 pm

Really nice interpretation. Goran Sollscher, who also played Bach on the 11-string guitar, never recorded the Chaconne on it unfortunately. I like his interpretation bout would love to see him have a go at this transcription.

soltirefa
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by soltirefa » Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:31 pm

Mickmac wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:25 pm
Really nice interpretation. Goran Sollscher, who also played Bach on the 11-string guitar, never recorded the Chaconne on it unfortunately. I like his interpretation bout would love to see him have a go at this transcription.
There used to be a video of Goran Sollscher playing the Chaconne live on his 11-string alto guitar (I believe it was in Japan). I just tried to find it and could not. It must have been deleted.

soltirefa
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by soltirefa » Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:40 pm

Mickmac wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:25 pm
Really nice interpretation. Goran Sollscher, who also played Bach on the 11-string guitar, never recorded the Chaconne on it unfortunately. I like his interpretation bout would love to see him have a go at this transcription.
I found the video I was talking about on Daily Motion, not YouTube

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xletkf

Part 2

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xlevcd

soltirefa
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by soltirefa » Fri Mar 22, 2019 3:00 pm

Yes, Wasser's Weiss Introduzzione sounds excellent, as does his guitar! I must look for a version that will work on my guitar (or transpose the alto guitar version you sent).
You could download the midi file of the Introduzzione here and then use a notation software program to transpose it. Scroll down and look for Sonata 50 and click on the speaker icon.

http://web.archive.org/web/201107111335 ... /Weiss.htm

Conall
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Conall » Fri Mar 22, 2019 4:15 pm

soltirefa wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 3:00 pm
Yes, Wasser's Weiss Introduzzione sounds excellent, as does his guitar! I must look for a version that will work on my guitar (or transpose the alto guitar version you sent).
You could download the midi file of the Introduzzione here and then use a notation software program to transpose it. Scroll down and look for Sonata 50 and click on the speaker icon.

http://web.archive.org/web/201107111335 ... /Weiss.htm
Funnily enough - I knew loads of Weiss was on the .luth page you mentioned and I went straight there & found it (but thanks anyway!).

So I just played it in Bb and it largely works fine. I just tuned my E6 to Eb, B9 to Bb and sometimes put a note up or down an octave (often that works better musically anyway since Weiss has some odd octave jumps in the middle of stepwise motion - prob related to whatever lute he had at the time or less noticeable on the octave courses).

But the midi files I didn't know about - will look at them so thank you for that!!

Conall
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Conall » Fri Mar 22, 2019 8:25 pm

soltirefa wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 3:00 pm
Yes, Wasser's Weiss Introduzzione sounds excellent, as does his guitar! I must look for a version that will work on my guitar (or transpose the alto guitar version you sent).
You could download the midi file of the Introduzzione here and then use a notation software program to transpose it. Scroll down and look for Sonata 50 and click on the speaker icon.

http://web.archive.org/web/201107111335 ... /Weiss.htm
Hey - this works too!

In fact I just play the pdf exactly as written (and it's the real pitch since my guitar is in E). If I tune my 3rd to f# I can even use exactly the same fingering! But I prefer normal 3=G so I ignore the fingering.I think in fact this G major transcription with normal tuning sounds better than the original Bb with 6=Eb, 9=Bb because that key & tuning is in fact too resonant / boomy.

Thanks again Soltirefa, much appreciated - and as you say, the midi file is there to change things if need be!

soltirefa
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by soltirefa » Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:31 pm

Hey - this works too!

In fact I just play the pdf exactly as written (and it's the real pitch since my guitar is in E).
Glad to know it worked! It's really a fantastic Weiss piece.

Conall
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Re: Bach Chaconne played by Moran Wasser on 11 string guitar

Post by Conall » Thu May 16, 2019 10:51 am

soltirefa wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:31 pm
Hey - this works too!

In fact I just play the pdf exactly as written (and it's the real pitch since my guitar is in E).
Glad to know it worked! It's really a fantastic Weiss piece.
The whole suite has become one of my favourite Weiss suites!

I downloaded the midi version into Musescore, transposed it to C major, slightly re-arranged some bits (mostly bass notes - I find Weiss' original bass lines strange at times i.e jumping up the octave etc in the middle of a descending bass line - something to do with peculiarities of baroque lute / the actual instrument he happened to have & be composing for at the time).

Unlike some of Weiss' suites all the movements are good quality in the suite - the courante & sarabande especially. But I like the other movements too. I found only the Presto needs one or 2 bass passages up the octave to make them more playable - otherwise the basses are mostly at the original register (transposed to C).

I'm currently learning the whole suite. At some point I'll try to record it, even just for myself but that will take a while (to learn then to record!).

Weiss music is certainly excellent for getting used to the extra basses of extended range guitar - more so than Bach & Dowland. The step wise bass motion of Weiss' music, while sometimes predictable, is also effective & allows more expression in upper melody since the bass line is catered for by mostly open basses.

Thanks again for the tips. I'm in extended range heaven!

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