Are D neck profiles going out of style

Construction and repair of Classical Guitar and related instruments
richay
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2018 3:02 am

Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by richay » Tue Oct 09, 2018 11:58 pm

My intentions this month were to get a new nylon string guitar, after reading the specs of numerous guitars from different brands - i am picking up that most affordable classicals have a c shaped. this is a real problem for me because with a d shape, i can stay less concious about my finger staying behind the neck. i have checked out the sites of cordoba, yamaha, and a few others and the only ones that come with my prefered profile are their higher priced series. can anyone here give me an explanation on why this is happening, and refer me to an affordable guitar of my liking? am i just going to have to buy a new guitar and have luthier replace the neck?
sorry for all the madness but im in a money tight situation and its just one thing after another. thank you in advance

Wuuthrad
Posts: 1174
Joined: Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:16 pm
Location: USA

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Wuuthrad » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:39 am

I know that all of Cordoba Espana series are D shape and can be found for a good price used.
"Pay no attention to what the critics say. A statue has never been erected in honor of a critic." -Jean Sibelius

Wuuthrad
Posts: 1174
Joined: Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:16 pm
Location: USA

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Wuuthrad » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:45 am

I think the classical guitar world is stuck in a rut and popular guitar shapes are just copies of things that don't really work the best for the wide variety of people playing, but it's easier to manufacture or build to a safe acceptable standard.

Thinking of a C shaped neck it's what you'd find on the cheapest Electric you'd find at WalMart... it's a freaking Baseball bat!lol

Of course this is more appropriate description of factory guitars, as Luthiers can build anything but it's out of the range of most people.
"Pay no attention to what the critics say. A statue has never been erected in honor of a critic." -Jean Sibelius

User avatar
joachim33
Posts: 928
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2017 8:21 pm
Location: Scania

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by joachim33 » Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:02 am

Hanika deploys D-shaped necks in their 50, 52, 54 and 56 models as a default. These are their less expensive models. They use C-shape in their higher specified models. As a custom option you can get choose your preferred neck shape.

Nikos_Greek
Posts: 260
Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:18 am
Location: Vienna, Austria

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Nikos_Greek » Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:13 am

Neck profile can be a huge issue for some people. My question would be, are you sure you prefer a D-shaped neck to a C one? I thought for many years that thin, D shape profiles suited me best, until I got a guitar with a thickish C shape. far from causing me any trouble this guitar approaches perfection as far as playability is concerned, far surpassing any D shaped guitars I have played. At the end of the day it is the particular guitar at hand that matters. Do not be preoccupied with misconceptions or false ideas. To your question, I do not think there is a tendency or trend towards C shape or D shape. Even within the same brand there are noticeable differences

Mr.Rain
Posts: 268
Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2016 4:43 pm
Location: Dublin/Alicante

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Mr.Rain » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:05 am

If you have small/weak hands, or muscle issues(RSI in my case) you will prefer a thinner profile and probably a smaller scale ...

If you are older you may also gravitate to smaller necks...

simonm
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9127
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 am
Location: Spain, IB

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by simonm » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:16 am

Nikos_Greek wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:13 am
Neck profile can be a huge issue for some people. ...
Except builders. :-) In the classical guitar world there is very little discussion about neck profiles and the terminology "C" and "D" are scarcely every used. I have only heard of necks as being "thinner" or "thicker". If you gave me a guitar and asked if it was c or d I would have difficulty - I don't really know what this refers to. I wonder if it is more US concept? Something for the workers in the big box stores to differentiate between different steel string neck profiles?

On the forum here there are rarely discussion about necks, just occasional side comments, so I suspect most players don't care all that much about it or maybe most guitars have basically very similar profiles. The only time I can recall noticing a profile is on a 1984 Granada guitar with long scale and 54mm nut. It "feels" wider and "flatter" but I can say if someone would call it c or d. I quite liked it.

I have 15-20 plans and I can only recall one off-hand that shows a neck profile but I can't say if it is c or d as I don't really understand the concept. Single builders and small workshops build whatever the are used to and I suspect that they mainly think about stability. For a small builder, they set up the neck carving machine and thats it. For a single builder the neck shape is not an issue, it can be anyway the client wants it. So long as the general direction is "less" and there is enough "meat" it is also very easy to reshape a neck. Adding wood is not easy. Refinishing the is an "it depends" type of question. So often changing guitars might be better.

As an amateur every neck I shape is different. I do it by feel. I tend to have relatively thick necks on my guitars so that reshaping them would relatively easy. It is semi-intentional based on the logic that wood is easy to remove and difficult to put back. Curiously one of my "to do" items at the moment is to copy the profile from the only plan I have with a neck profile (A Santos) and to try that on a current build.


If there was a common terminology and some neck standards, it would be interesting to find out what people prefer but for the moment I think the terminology is too vague. Maybe some dealers have an insight into it.

Edit.
My teacher who has lived from guitar teaching and playing for 40+ years said that a concert player practicing 4-10 hours a day will mostly likely prefer a somewhat thicker neck. In his view the thinner neck is more likely to cause injury when someone is practicing that amount. However, profile shape was not mentioned.

User avatar
petermc61
Posts: 6831
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2012 12:11 am
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by petermc61 » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:30 am

I am not sure, but I have just written down a big C on a piece of paper and also a big D. As far as I can tell if C is the ‘normal’ neck then the D must have the curve up on top where the strings should be. Seems to me that would be harder to play. :shock:

Seter
Posts: 67
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:34 am
Location: Houston, TX

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Seter » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:22 pm

To me the D profile is where the central part of the back is nearly flat. My old Yamaha G-245S is like that, as is my 6 string Ibanez bass (very similar neck profiles overall oddly enough). I believe my other classical guitar necks are more C shaped. It isn't too much trouble to switch from one to the other.

User avatar
souldier
Posts: 1385
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:45 pm
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by souldier » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:28 pm

I've played a tonne of guitars with different neck thicknesses/shapes. My hands much prefer a thinner C shape profile... It just feels a lot less chunky, easier to barre, etc. D shape necks feels overwhelming and fatiguing. One is not superior over to the other... it all depends on the individuals anatomy and there are various factors that come into play. One will not know which they prefer until they try different guitars for themselves.
"Success grants its rewards to a few, but is the dream of the multitudes.
Excellence is available to all, but is accepted only by a few." - Christopher Parkening

User avatar
pogmoor
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9768
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2004 10:55 am
Location: Oxfordshire, UK

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by pogmoor » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:19 pm

simonm wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:16 am
...I can't say if it is c or d as I don't really understand the concept...
I too am mystified by this terminology - as far as I can see, in most fonts, the curvature of the letters C and D is much the same. Cans someone tell me what it means?
Eric from GuitarLoot
Renaissance and Baroque freak; classical guitars by Lester Backshall (2008), Ramirez (Guitarra del Tiempo 2017),
Yamaha (SLG 130NW silent classical guitar 2014).

User avatar
Beowulf
Posts: 1197
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 5:02 pm
Location: London, Ontario CANADA

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Beowulf » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:25 pm

This may be helpful:
neck-shapes.gif
The "U" shape is often described as an oval and the "D" shape as a flattened oval. The "C" shape curves away from the apex of the curve more rapidly.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
1971 Yamaha GC-10 (Hideyuki Ezaki)
2017 Yamaha GC82S (Akio Naniki/Naohiro Kawashima)

User avatar
pogmoor
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9768
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2004 10:55 am
Location: Oxfordshire, UK

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by pogmoor » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:29 pm

Thank you Beowulf :)
Eric from GuitarLoot
Renaissance and Baroque freak; classical guitars by Lester Backshall (2008), Ramirez (Guitarra del Tiempo 2017),
Yamaha (SLG 130NW silent classical guitar 2014).

User avatar
Christopher Langley
Student of the online lessons
Posts: 995
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2018 6:59 pm
Location: Missouri

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Christopher Langley » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:34 pm

*Edit*

Moving my post to the more relevant thread.

I agree it seems D shaped necks seem harder to come by, especially at budget level.
Cordoba CP110
https://youtu.be/AJsinZ8LLhE

User avatar
Beowulf
Posts: 1197
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 5:02 pm
Location: London, Ontario CANADA

Re: Are D neck profiles going out of style

Post by Beowulf » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:57 pm

pogmoor wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:29 pm
Thank you Beowulf :)
You are most welcome. It is remarkable what one can find in the online library!
1971 Yamaha GC-10 (Hideyuki Ezaki)
2017 Yamaha GC82S (Akio Naniki/Naohiro Kawashima)

Return to “Luthiers”